maybe ppl like modding bc its fun
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Why does it have to be so black and white though? I know the whole “limitations breed creativity” thing is popular, and sure, there’s truth to it, but it’s been said to death and it doesn’t need to be brought up every single time.
You don’t need firmware mods to write good tunes. But if someone needs a certain function for their setup, and adding it makes things easier or saves them some money, that doesn’t mean they somehow can’t be creative within limitations.
A firmware update probably won’t make you write better music, but it might make you try stuff you wouldn’t have tried otherwise. I don’t really see what’s so weird about that, or why it has to turn into a lecture about creativity.
Anyway, I think this discussion has pretty much run its course. Elektron has every right to decide what kind of discussions they allow on their forum, even if I personally think embracing the open source community could have been an interesting path for them, though that’s really a separate discussion.
And people also have every right, within the law, to do whatever they want with hardware they’ve bought.
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Always fun to do these mind games on how long it’s been compared to something even older. 25 years is kind of crazy old 
In this regard though SidStation was launched 5 years after Commodore was liquidated as a company, and their chip fab (the old MOS Technology) was sold off in 95.
So there was nobody left to deal with bricked units back then… a bit different from now 
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I would support Elektron imposing an absolute ban on discussions of third-party hacks/firmware here. Just go wild with the ban-hammer and get the children out of the room, please.
Not because I think jailbreaking devices is ethically wrong, but because it shows a real lack of consideration for where we are. This forum is hosted by a company who, aside from wanting their devices to be used as designed, could face very annoying legal consequences when similar discussions are had about other companies’ products.
On top of which, for whatever reason (maybe because they’re mostly new to forum and trying to promote something rather than long-standing members?) it doesn’t seem like hacked-firmware enthusiasts are willing to limit themselves to relevant threads. Just ban them. Posting on an electronic-musical-device forum isn’t a human right, the only reason this joint remains appealing to anyone is because it is actively moderated.
As for the more general point: I work for one of the companies whose products are being jail-broken. The attitude within the company really isn’t “oh no, we fear these pirates who are craftily breaching our defences and ruining our sales strategy.” Everyone knows it’s Linux under the hood and LLMs have made it much easier to reverse-engineer the data structures etc. There’s just a sense of exhaustion at the pile of security/legal/contractual problems that arise, you know, boring stuff that a bedroom vibe-coder doesn’t have to worry about. Also some questions about whether the thousands of hours that go into design to make sure that hardware and software work together elegantly, into testing to make sure the machine won’t shit the bed onstage, et cetera… As someone posted above, if you think of all hardware as just a processor and some MIDI knobs ready to host your superior vision, why not just use a laptop?
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Maybe because, without thinking you’re somehow superior, having the features you want to explore added in a sensible way to a machine you already know inside out and have years of muscle memory with is pretty different from rebuilding a whole setup and workflow from scratch?
I don’t get why everything always has to turn personal.
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Mods are cool. That is one thing. Whiny conspiracy theories are another.
I just don’t understand the leap of logic from “something wasn’t included” to “that thing was intentionally withheld from us.”
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I can’t imagine what it must feel like to design an instrument and then have people want to completely change it into something else. Small feature additions I can understand but some of the hacks for Move for example seem to turn it into something completely different. Why not just get a laptop and a controller at that point.
At the same time, a company saying that a certain feature is not possible due to hardware limitations and then someone proves it is in fact possible… not a great look. I’m curious if this is going to lead to more openness and transparency with devs in the future or if it will just result in a total shutdown of information. “You get what you get and you don’t get upset, no further comment.” Kind of a minefield for them really.
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I think modifying the device you own to make it work better for you is fine and cool.
I think insisting there is a right to talk about how you did it on someone else’s forum (when they have explicitly asked everyone not to) is shitty. And yes, it’s personal, I’m judging people for their bad manners and childish sense of entitlement to a virtual space that someone else maintains.
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Ah okay, then I hadn’t realized who the criticism was aimed at. Sorry.
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Is there an actual statement tied to elektron that claims this? I’m truly curious, not just trying to stump anyone.
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Everything that makes a digital instrument feel deliberate and not janky is the result of not implementing things that are technically possible. Processing power is fungible after all.
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what
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not trying to dig any deeper than this, but there are many mentions over the years
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Thank you. Even there, somebody seems to be pointing out a possible mixup in that some claims are specifically about Overbridge and they can’t seem to find claims simply about audio over usb. I understand that there are mentions, but mentions can just spread from mentions.
On the other hand I did ask for someone tied to elektron and there they are, so that ultimately settles it.
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Cowbody coding is not QA.
“I got this hack working” is far from proof that a stable capability has been uncovered.
I bet a trusty LLM would elaborate on this very thing if asked.
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Elektron is missing an opportunity here to release a version of the Models with generic labels on all the knobs, no firmware, and a new tool called OverVibe that lets you plug in your LLM of choice and go ham on making it do weird stuff.
Call it Model:Model.
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I read here a lot of comments of people who both support the legit Elektron policy on third party firmware AND at the same time the right of people to hack stuff they bought.
Very few people here still complain about the policy, but a lot of people says that those who want to mod their Elektron boxes are untalented, unethical, whining, short minded people. Elektron staff wrote here they are ok with hacking and you are trying to sell us that hacking in unethical ; that’s fact vs opinion.
Maybe are you confuse about the difference between hackers vs pirates vs script kiddies ?
Maybe thousands of security breaches from products from compagnies yelling at us their products are 100% safe for customers is something that need to be prooved ? Is ‘trust us’ just a marketing gimmick nowadays ? Maybe capitalism is suffering the backfire it started ?
Real questions.
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You’re describing a feature of capitalism as if it were a bug. Competition and innovation are there by design. What’s happening is exactly how it is supposed to work.
An innovation, in this case AI, makes it possible to improve a product, in this case a synth, at a lower cost, ultimately for the benefit of the consumer. Companies tied to outdated business models and practices will be forced to adapt for the benefit of consumers or perish. No backfire here, free market working by the book. Surprising, isn’t it?
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Oh I don’t know actually. Not trying to spread disinformation. Either way though I could see this issue popping up frequently. Either they have to get into the weeds discussing the exact technical/manpower/business/political reasons why a feature isn’t happening, or more likely companies will just stop commenting on development at all. “It’s a hardware limitation” used to be a simple, plausible way to avoid those conversations but if someone comes back with “I got it working in an hour with AI” that kind of changes the discussion.
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lol timely video from Gamers Nexus -
Not necessarily relevant to this particular discussion of course, but demonstrates how awesome and important hacking and the DIY spirit can be.
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