Midi messages on start

I am sequencing some iOS synths and they seem to start with default parameters.
Whenever i set some bank/program/CC values on the OT’s midi tracks, they are not taken in account on start by the iOS synths.

Isn’t the OT sending these infos when pressing play (seems very strange). How are the synths supposed to know their bank/program/cc values when starting to play?

I really don’t know much about the midi side of things, but I remember reading this bit in the manual when I was searching for something related. Maybe it will help? Pressing stop-stop to send all values:

When pressing [STOP] a note off command will be sent for any MIDI notes still playing. If the
sequencer is stopped, quickly pressing [STOP] + [STOP] will send an all notes off command,
resend CC parameter values as well as any program change values for all tracks to which a
MIDI channel has been assigned.

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I had this issue, actually. I wrote a whole live set with the DT/DN and an iPad. Sometimes, the PC/CC/etc messages would go through properly from the DN, other times, they would be wrong (PC wouldn’t load, but new CC parameters would, making the previous patch go nuts). I think it’s just an issue with timing. I as hosting AUv3 in AUM, btw.

So i should try to press STOP+STOP before pressing PLAY?

Gosh not very intuitive.

I think so. Worth a try. Like I say, I’m no expert on these things.

Nope it doesn’t. It fucks up the preset.

I really don’t get the concept of not sending out the midi parameters when pressing play. How does it work with other hardware/software?

Ah, no idea then. I’ll let the midi experts take over.

@Blasted_pingin I answered you on Audiofanzine. Isn’t it just a bank message sending problem with the first program change sent ?

A midi processor would solve this.

My last message has no answer.

I am not clear at all with how the MIDI works, i might ask a few times the same information.

I don’t really understand what you mean. All i know is I set parameters and the synths don’t receive the infos.
I’d like to know how it works with hardware device: how do they get the parameters/CC values/bank presets infos if the OT don’t tell them on start?

I’d rather not buy/add a device just for something that seems so basic.

I can make a test with a midi monitor.

Sorry, I didn’t see the notification.
Easier here !

I really don’t like OT program changes send implementation. I don’t use them.
Machinedrum and Monomachine were doing better before, and DT/DN do it better after.

A midi processor is a midi music swiss army knife that can correct most of lacking midi features and find creative things, like control comb filters pitch with midi notes…

@Blasted_pingin, as I told you it’s much easier to decipher with a midi monitor.

So : bank and pc messages of the last pattern are sent at startup. Not sent again if you press play.

If you reload the project, the pattern chosen while saving is loaded with its bank and pc messages sent.

You can send them back with double stop, or doing a pattern change with patterns using different parts.

Using different parts is necessary, and you can’t resend the same program changes consecutively. I don’t like these behaviors > midi processor.

Does reload part trigger the PC messages?

I agree this is way better implemented in DT/DN, just p-lock and be done with it. Except for the encoder-pushing to activate, I hate that.

Ok then it might be the problem i encounter. When i monitor i don’t see any bank/pc message when starting up the pattern.
Wrong MIDI config within the OT?

I have all set to Int+Ext in the midi sub menu.

I wasn’t clear. By startup I meant powering on OT.

So, program changes aren’t sent when you press play after OT startup, because they been already sent at startup (I even saw them sent twice on my midi monitor).

PROJECT > MIDI settings mostly* concern audio tracks and sync, and shouldn’t influence midi send from midi tracks.

*I’d say maybe exclusively if there weren’t particularities is midi tracks and audio tracks channels are shared.

Yeah, I guess it can be argued either way if this behavior is useful. It’s kind of old-school.

I can see a situation where you would want program changes to be sent only once, when loading the project. Before starting playback (or when resetting by STOP-STOP).

Some synths will take longer to perform a program change than others.
Resending with every start or pattern change could result in a less instantaneous and glitchy experience.

Or you might actually not want to reload the patch, after applying some automation.

Suggestion for OP: perhaps try reloading the project once the iOS synths are up and running.
That way your old patches should be recalled.

Reload Part does not trigger PC by the way, tried it.
Changing parts does, if PC are set to a different value.

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Sure, like tweaking the synth.
Choice please ! :wink:

Considering latency, using PC set in MIDI > SYNC, match patches to patterns ?
(Or…a midi processor?:content:)

Thanks, wasn’t 100% sure…

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Optional p-lock would be great, like the Digis.
But I guess that’s not gonna happen with a setup page parameter.

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Elektron usually keep retro compatibility or previous features/habits…

Yes what comes mind is to power on the OT once all is ready and set on the iPad.

No need to power cycle imho.
Synths have to be ready for sure.

I also thought about this, or if the project is already (re)loaded : double stop if start pattern is already selected, or a pattern change with start pattern selection…