If anyone is successfully launching A4 patterns with Ableton, I am hoping you can help me out. I am using the multi map to dsend midi notes. When I set the “chg mode” in the Multi-Map edit to “Direct Start”, it works, but 2 steps are played on the first beat, which offsets the pattern by a 16th note. So the patterns are not playing correctly. I am sending pattern changes via midi notes. I don’t know if it’s Live or A4 that’s having the issue here. I am so close to getting this working, if anyone has suggestions it would be really helpful, I cannot find much online.
1 Like
Thank you for the response. I already tried this, but for whatever reason, when you send a PC message from Live to A4, there is a 1 bar delay in triggering the pattern.
I am trying to change patterns on A4 using the Multi Map via sending midi notes. I cannot get any of the 3 modes to work, but I am really close with “Direct Change”. What I am trying to figure out is why the A4 “stutters” when a pattern is launched, causing the pattern to be 1 beat out of sync with Live.
Hope that explains my problem a little better.
I use to have this problem with ableton triggering patch changes on my revolution… You are using clips with the pattern change message set for the clip right? (not sure how to technically explain it - but it’s those little pull down menus in the bottom left of the piano roll window)
I think it’s a latency thing… As if your clips are quantized to send the message on the first beat, by the time it gets to the A4 its missed its chance to change- hence why the delay.
I think I got around it by turning off quantise for any clips that send patch change info and making sure they send just before the beat. I think there’s a way to set delay compensation for sending program changes but someone else may have to step in there cos I can’t remember exactly.
Edit. Sorry just re read your post. Your sending notes… Same principle tho… Delay compensation needs to be adjusted so they are sent before the beat…
I think I got around it by turning off quantise for any clips that send patch change info and making sure they send just before the beat. I think there’s a way to set delay compensation for sending program changes but someone else may have to step in there cos I can’t remember exactly.
Thanks for the response. So when you say you “got around” it, you were able to get it working and it’s tight? I can get the pattern to change at the proper time by selecting “Direct Change” in the Multi Map edit properties. But the pattern stutters on the first beat, and then the pattern is offset by a beat and it is skewed. SO the second time around beat one of the pattern actually sounds on beat 2. If I just hit play on Ableton Push, everything works and is in sync. The stutter only happens when I send midi notes to change the pattern.
Interesting. I see now I was proposing a solution to a slightly different problem. I’m gonna have a go at multi map mode with ableton tomorrow and try to recreate your issue… Are you sending the midi notes as part of a clip or are they routed from a keyboard/push thru live?
Really appreciate the help. I am sending the notes as part of a clip. I have it setup as follows:
Pattern Inc = 1
Chg Mode = D. Start
The rest I leave as the default.
A couple things. If I set it to Chg Mode = D. Jump, it works perfectly with one exception. When switching patterns, the A4 plays the first note of the previous pattern before switching. So for example, it will play trig 1 from pattern A1, then play trig 2 from pattern A2. As soon as I swith patterns, same deal.
When set to Chg Mode = D. Start, it starts on the correct trig, but plays the first 2 trigs at double speed, and throws the rest of the pattern off.
When set to Chg Mode = Seq, the A4 does the exact same thing as when using Pgm change messages with the 1-2 bar delay.
For what it’s worth, I could care less how I accomplish this, so I will try and figure out what you mean by setting up a delay for the Pgm change messages. I don’t need to do it via sending midi notes.
Thanks again.
I’ve found this is a problem in both Cubase and Live, the A4 just doesn’t sync right with PC MSG when DAW sends songs position too.
Use the Multimap function and change patterns via note.
I gave up on the PC Messages. It’s actually the Multi-Map I am having problems with.
I have been able to get PC mode working fine with it. Providing pattern changes are only wanted at the start of the pattern - not mid pattern
The important settings are:
Have clips setup so that pc change clips are their own entity (ie they don’t have other info in them that needs to be synced). Then set them to be non looping, and have a launch quantization setting of ‘none’… This way the PC is always sent before the beat therefor always gets to the a4 in time. Pgm 1-128 represent all the patterns across all the banks.
Then in the A4 set it to change patterns at start of pattern or bar etc.
If you need other midi cc going to the a4, create a clip group in ableton to trigger 1 non quantized PC change, and 1 quantised clip with cc info. Likewise if you are in arrangement view, just slide all your pc change clips slightly to the left so they come first.
In multi map mode I’m not getting any of the issues you mentioned. All pattern trigger modes are actually working properly me without missing any beats or starting when they shouldn’t… Which leads me to think you need to maybe shift your midi delay timing in your ableton preferences for whatever midi interface you are using… I’m using a4 usb midi and just triggering a quantized clip with midi notes placed on the beat.
Other possibility is you have a midi feedback going on? Otherwise Im stumped…
Actually I do find seq still doesn’t start to one loop after the note is triggered… Which is the exact same issue and solution as the pc change I mentioned.
The workaround for this was and an alternative to the pc clip non quantising is to increase the midi clock sync delay for your interface… Eventually it will start to work as it should… Mine is +194… Which is disgustingly large.
I was also able to recreate the doubling of the beat at the start if I had a negative track delay and a positive midi clock sync delay… Worth checking your settings.
Thanks so much for this. So this explains some things. I have my midi clock sync delay set to -41.5. I have to set it to -41.5 to get my A4 in sync with Live. I am pretty new to Live, I will need to figure out how to setup track delay. First I will try and get the PC messages working as you have done. I really appreciate the ideas and the help here. Just want to stop troubleshooting and spend time making music.
Yup the PC messages work like a charm this way. Perfect for queueing up scenes in Live. Works great with push.
Thank you for your help Mindseye, you are a scholar and a gentleman!
You’re welcome… I picked up a few things out of that a also.
Hi dear Elektronauts,
after frustrating period of trying to find the way how to change patterns in A4 via Ableton I finally did find the way and one definitive set up which works perfectly.
So… here it is
setting up A4:
Midi config:
-midi sync - enable- clock receive,transport receive,prog ch receive
-midi port config. -out port func - midi, thru port func - midi, input from - usb/midi (depends on type of connection you use),the same for output to, output ch - trk ch (this cause that you can send from ableton midi notes to each of A4’s track (in Ableton you will have separate channel for each A4’s track - see in Ableton set up later in this post), param output - nrpn, encoder dest - int+ext, keyboard dest - int+ext, mute dest - int+ext, enable all three other possibilities bellow mute dest
- midi channels - tr1 -1,etc. ,perf channel - 8, auto channel - 9, prog ch in - 8, prog ch out - auto
- multi map edit - clear all entries and create one, C0 - G10, and set it up this way: function - pat.play,range low - c0, range high - G10, pattern A01, pattern inc - 1, transpose - 0, transpose inc - 0, chg mode - d.Jump
that is all in A4
and now how to set up Ableton
in Preferences - midi set up - input - enable Analog 4 track in, in section midi outpu enable Analog 4 track in and sync
in session view create five midi tracks and one audio track
route each track like this: midi input - no input, midi output - to Analog 4, channel - 1 for track 1, 2 for track 2, etc and for the fifth midi track choose: midi input - no input, midi output - to Analog 4,channel - 8 (this track in ableton will be changing patterns in A4 via clips - see bellow
Name first four tracks in Ableton like A4 - T1, A4- T2, etc and the fifth midi track name Program change.
the last track you did create is audio track and rout it like this: audio from - choose the ext (i suppose you use external sound card to which is connected your A4) and channels to which is connected your A4, then choose Monitoring - IN and audio out to - master
now everything is set up correctly,so it works in this logic
if you create blank midi clip in ableton’s track number 5 (we named it prog change) and create a note - (-C2) (yes i don’t know why but -C2 is C0 in A4), switch off the loop button in section notes down in the clips setting and now if you start playing live, you A4 starts play in sync (sync delay you set up in preferences of ableton) and any time you launch the clip from track 5, the pattern in A4 is changed according the note which is in the clip, so the clip with note -C#2 the pattern in A4 will change to patternA02, note -D2 will change A4 pattern to A03 etc.
in other tracks which every represent the track in A4 you can freedomly create midi clips which will be triggering A4’s tracks sounds
if you use triggless parameter changing,you can change parameters through sequencer possibilities of A4
that is all
enjoy it
1 Like
Thanks!
Wow thanks~!!!
I will try this as soon as i get home
btw this will work with AR too?
THIS!!! Thanks.
1 Like