How to create a single cycle pulse

bolandross · 2015-01-27T07:26:00.000Z

Hi folks,

is there a method you could recommend to create very short impulses (like the machinedrum does with the impulse-machines)?

A single cycle pulse would be great to have, but I guess this isn’t that easy to accomplish since the MnM doesn’t restart its oscillators when triggered?

I am looking forward to your suggestions and ideas, thanks in advance!

Best regards,
Boland

bolandross · 2015-03-03T11:19:12.000Z

Hmm…

sorry for the bump, but I am still searching for a solution.

Any ideas?

rikrak · 2015-03-03T11:53:11.000Z

What are you trying to achieve, a fast clicky transient for percussion, or something else?

EDIT:
Try these settings:

DPRO WAVE
KEYTRACKING HPF OFF, LPF OFF

SYNTH:
WAVE S01 (Default Bank)
WP 0
WPM 0
WPRS OFF
SYNC SFRQ
SFRQ 64
TUNE 0

AMP:
ATK 0
HOLD 0
DEC 0
REL 0
DIST 63
VOL 63
PAN 0
PORT 0

FILTER:
BASE 28
WDTH 0
HPQ 0
LPQ 0
ATK 0
DEC 0
BOFS 0
WOFS 0

EFFECTS:
All Default (no effects)

LFOs:
All Defaults (no LFOs)

Using an Oscilloscope, I can see this produces a dampened single cycle every time it is trigged as a C3 Note. The waveform is almost exactly the same every time.

bolandross · 2015-03-03T19:26:20.000Z

Hey rikrak!

First of all, thanks for your help, this is really great stuff, I am already amazed!

What I am trying to achieve is two things:

I need a consistent transient sound that I can use for designing certain drum sounds.
I want to trigger some modular devices which wish to be triggered with a short gate signal (one square wave cycle I guess). This works nicely with the Machinedrum, but I wanted to reproduce it with the MnM

For plan no. 1 you already helped me to get something quite consistent out of my monomachine. Anyhow, I am getting some level changes each time I trig the sound (please see the attachment). This is really strange. I tried a lot of things, different waveforms, filtering, envelopes etc. But I guess it really depends on the status of the oscillator which then gets amplified by the short envelope hold=0. Like opening a gate and then amplifying what is there. Sometimes the waveform is on its maximum, and sometimes isn’t I guess?

What would be the way to go if I wanted to create a single cycle square wave form? Thanks already for your effort!!

Best regards,
Bolandross

impulses.JPG1523×707 55.9 KB

rikrak · 2015-03-03T21:53:52.000Z

I managed to get a consistent amplitude by applying a square wave LFO but I forget the settings exactly - I’ll check it out tomorrow for you.

With regards to getting a square wave single cycle though - that might be trickier but probably possible. I would experiment with a longer Hold setting. It might require a specific waveform loaded into the DPRO bank.

The Monomachine is incredibly versatile. You can max out settings because there are several gain stages to control the final level.

Creating consistent results is tricky because the oscillators can’t be set to start exactly the same each trig, as you say.

At first I hated this and used the Octatrack to sample hits I wanted to repeat exactly. However, I came to love the slightly analogue nature - i can listen to Monomachine loops for a long time without my ears getting tired of the repetition.

I realise you need a steady pulse though - I’ll see what I can come up with - it’s a fun exercise for sure!

pselodux · 2015-03-03T22:21:59.000Z

What about loading in a custom waveform of just 100% positive signal, ie. DC offset silence, and then modifying that with an amp envelope? I don’t actually have a monomachine so I don’t know if that’d work… but worth a try!

FreeFall · 2015-03-04T06:26:09.000Z

Stop everything you are doing, and Google ‘adventure kid wave forms’. This guy, no, this saint of a man, has created THOUSANDS of SCWs free for download. It’s practically a legendary cache of waves.

You need to set the LOOP function in C6 before transfer to the MNM.

rikrak · 2015-03-04T10:26:48.000Z

""FreeFall"":

Stop everything you are doing, and Google ‘adventure kid wave forms’. This guy, no, this saint of a man, has created THOUSANDS of SCWs free for download. It’s practically a legendary cache of waves.

You need to set the LOOP function in C6 before transfer to the MNM.

The principle is the same as using any of the DigiPro waveforms but it won’t get around the problem of inconsistency with regards to slight changes in amplitude or pitch when the trig is fired. The waveform is treated as a free-running oscillator. (Unlike using the AKWF samples with the Octatrack, where they are just played as samples and therefore identical for every trig).

I’ve had another go at minimizing the amplitude variance today, but I can’t improve on the above patch. It’s the nearest I can get to a consistent single-cycle click.

pselodux’ may be onto something with the idea of a 100% positive signal.

There’s also the BBOX approach. These settings result in 2 cycles of a dampened trapezoid waveform, using C0 to trigger the bassdrum sample.

DPRO BBOX
KEYTRACKING HPF OFF, LPF OFF

SYNTH:
Default

AMP:
ATK 0
HOLD 0
DEC 0
REL 0
DIST 63
VOL 63
PAN 0
PORT 0

FILTER:
BASE 56
WDTH 0
HPQ 0
LPQ 0
ATK 0
DEC 0
BOFS -64
WOFS 63

EFFECTS:
Default

LFOs:
Default

bolandross · 2015-03-04T14:01:27.000Z

""pselodux"":

What about loading in a custom waveform of just 100% positive signal, ie. DC offset silence, and then modifying that with an amp envelope? I don’t actually have a monomachine so I don’t know if that’d work… but worth a try!

This is a very good idea, thanks for that.

Sadly, after trying that, it seems to me like the Monomachine is altering the waveforms after receiving them.
So … the DC offset got removed and with similar custom drawn ones I did myself in a wave editor, I wasn’t very lucky either … this is a bit frustrating, what is the point of offering this feature then?

Also … when using the C6 tool, no matter what value I defined for “LOOP: yes/no”, the waveform was always looped, so chance for single shots.

Ugh … then I tried using the BBOX machine, which at least got me consistent hits (thanks rikrak for pointing me into this direction and giving me some great directions to go along).

rikrak · 2015-03-04T14:44:34.000Z

Don’t give up on the waveform import idea just yet. You need to use the DigiPro conversion button before sending them across using C6. I’m away from my Mac but see this thread from the old forum:
http://elektron-users.com/index.php?option=com_fireboard&Itemid=28&func=view&catid=9&id=144782

Then you may need to use a very fast ramp LFO on the VOL parameter rather than relying on the Amp envelope itself.

I know other users have acheived excellent percussion synthesis. I’m pretty new to the Monomachine so I’m still experimenting myself.

bolandross · 2015-03-04T15:45:50.000Z

Thanks for the link.

The thing is, that I am not getting an error message when transferring my waves.

Everything works as intended, and even the preview displays the waves that I transferred. I am also converting them by pressing the DigiPRO button.

It works with normal waves which go over and below 0, but if I take the working waves as a template and draw something more “unusual” into them, it seems like it gets rounded or “corrected” which defeats the purpose imho.

Also … using the LFO for controlling the VOL parameter on the Monomachine always created unwanted artifacts for me, which might ruin the “very sensitive” wave cycle we are trying to achieve
See this thread for more info. I contacted Elektron support which told me that they would look into this since it got confirmed by some more users than me.

rikrak · 2015-03-04T19:32:56.000Z

Ah ok. It sounds like the Monomachine extracts a single cycle from the wave by looking at when it crosses zero.

Veets · 2015-03-06T19:17:48.000Z

I also tried to do this exact same thing at one point and the 100% positive signal did not seem to work for me either.

Here’s another possibility that I did not try.

The Mono will accept waveforms of about 0.1 seconds length maximum. So make a single-cycle pulse wave that goes positive for about 0.09 seconds and negative for 0.01 seconds. There’s a slim chance that this might work, although it will get looped and sound like a high-pass filtered square wave if you don’t set the envelope to cut it off really quick.

The only way I can get consistent pseudo-clicks out of the Mono is with envelopes, and these don’t really sound that clicky… It’s a pity that the DPro machines don’t do the above as it would be really useful. I would love to see the Mono’s OS go open source as there is a lot of potential in the Mono that is untapped.

Another thing that I have not tried but might work is the Noise cranked up full blast with a really fast envelope.

zfigz · 2015-03-06T22:05:44.000Z

""Veets"":

I would love to see the Mono’s OS go open source as there is a lot of potential in the Mono that is untapped.

i would love this, but i’ve consistently read that the mono os has been officially tapped out, no more space to improve upon because elektron has pushed it to its limits.

bolandross · 2015-03-09T20:06:08.000Z

I made some further attempts in uploading such a square wave Veets described, but it always became strangely modified after transferring.

I am going to contact Elektron support, maybe they have a good explanation for this kind of behavior.

Stay tuned.

pselodux · 2015-03-09T22:24:12.000Z

""Veets"":

The only way I can get consistent pseudo-clicks out of the Mono is with envelopes, and these don’t really sound that clicky… It’s a pity that the DPro machines don’t do the above as it would be really useful. I would love to see the Mono’s OS go open source as there is a lot of potential in the Mono that is untapped.

Yeah, it’s a shame it doesn’t do that… because then it’d probably be not too difficult to get some kind of pseudo-CV (or gate, at the very least) output for analog gear… but then again that’s treading on the A4 features so they wouldn’t want to do that now, would they

bolandross · 2015-03-13T14:54:50.000Z

I got a response from the Elektron team and tought it would be good idea to keep you updated:

Hi again,
I’ve had a chat with the developers and the Monomachine does not process the sample, that is done entirely in C6.
When converting a sample it is normalized and put through a DC offset filter which is why your 100% positive waveform does not work. Even if you could transfer that waveform in its original form the Monomachine could not be used to send any control voltages since the outputs are not DC coupled.
The feature is indeed advertised as custom user waveforms, but the feature was created to provide the user with a way to introduce their own timbres, not to control external gear, which would not even be possible in the first place.
Regards,
Simon – Elektron

Just for your information,

best regards,
Boland