How do you talk to labels?

The Lounge General Discussion
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Hey all,

I’ve been fortunate enough to be approached by a few labels lately. However, I find myself completely lost in how to talk to them. Despite them having contacted me, they act and speak as if they’re calling the shots before we’ve even begun the conversation, saying things like “We like your music but we’d like to hear something more along these lines”, or “We can promote you but only if you …” or “You’d have to cover this and this and this yourself.”

Like, I don’t get it. It’s like asking someone if they want coffee and then giving them a real bad cup. Why would anyone want that, sender or receiver?

Is this how it works or am I just getting contacted by shitty people?

EDIT: They’re not shitty people. I regret putting it like that. Just a bit vague, 's all. And I wanted to understand the lingo in this world, hence the purpose of this post. Clearly, I used the wrong lingo myself.

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I experienced this a little recently. For me it’s just like, are you into the label? Even if they have conditions, does the mutual agreement benefit you in some way? Sometimes I say no to these things if the label looks cheap and is not in line with my ethos, but if there is some connection in some way I generally accept. But I’ve said no a lot over the years, even look like a bit of a dick at times for doing so.

I like being invited to participate in things. I certainly can’t be bothered hustling. But if I created something I was very proud of, I would certainly shop around.

I think the hardest thing these days is self control. Keeping your work to yourself. It’s hard to keep a secret and to stop yourself from posting the process or the bare minimum results. Even just posting your work on your own bandcamp page. There’s a lot to be said for keeping everything secret, I think, and then approach labels on your own terms when you’re ready. A released album is released, after all.

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Yeah, that’s good advice. Thanks. One of them is pretty cool, actually, but as you say, I’m too old for this kind of hustling thing. I don’t mind a modest deal where I’m doing much of the work and participate in the risk, but I do mind the attitude. If we’re in it together, we should treat each other as such.

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Do you mean they’ve suggested you cover some of the expenses? Like cover art, music video or mastering costs or something like that? For me those would be a definite NO (unless it’s a smallish release and I’m doing cover art or music video myself). Like you said, we / you are already doing a lot of the work by producing and recording, perhaps even mastering the tracks ourselves.

I get that a label actively wants and deserves to be there in the process in things like selecting tracks for a release, have a say on the cover, who’s doing mastering, what’s the ”single”…

I still think (physical) releases are cool but I’m also too old to get excited just about the prospect of having a physical release out there with my name on it. So if a label approached me, I’d be a lot more wary of the things I promise to do for free than I was when I was younger (I actually still ”owe” three albums to a label I signed a 5-album deal with in 2004). Which is fine, because they’ve also moved on to things that make more sense to them business-wise. :smiley:

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Sounds pretty familiar to me. I don’t care anymore. In this internet era, small labels can only do very little for you any way.

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I think this is partly an age thing. At this point, I’ve done some stuff throughout life I’m pretty proud of, and I don’t need to prove myself. Even though it would be great to have a platform for music that’s slightly more established - there’s not much I love more than making music - I don’t need the recognition or the affirmation. I’d love the context, but having been in both bad and good contexts throughout life, I can tell the bad ones are never worth it. No matter the gain, never.

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I’d say I’m probably in a similar position musically and mentally and it’s the happiest I’ve ever been ”artistically” in my ~20 years of making music and all that comes with it. Judging by that, you’re in a happy place and don’t have to give that up unless something really enticing is thrown your way.

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I think this gets quickly into the topic of whether labels are necessary at all. If you have ambitions of reaching a much wider audience, and you loathe the idea of self-promotion, finding a label could be the way to go. At least in the short-term. For me, any approaches where the tone is off or the attitude is shitty would get canned immediately. Likewise anyone trying to influence my music. Otherwise, no harm in making a counter-offer.

If it was me, and I wanted to get signed, I’d be researching which labels in my genre have a good reputation (talk to artists they work with, etc), then approach them directly. Be upfront about what you want and try to come up with a mutually beneficial arrangement.

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I honestly don’t think you should abide to any of their terms in regards To your creativity. the bump in streams you would get from a small label is probably minuscule. It of course depends on the label, but in all honesty I don’t think a person sitting in his/her/their basement is gonna give you that much.

It honestly sounds like ”härskarteknik” where the person talks big to sound important and like he/she is a big deal.

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The Dragons Den springs to mind

“We can get yo out there/faster if you give us 75 per cent of your business”.

In these days of multi social platforms that are free are labels necessary? Cant you create your own?

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Some labels have this attitude like if it is still the 70’s, 80’s and 90’s when you were really dependent on them to release any music at all. Which results in attitudes as “you want your music released? Then you are my bitch now”. This part of the music business unfortunately still resonates here and there.

Luckily we are not really dependent on labels anymore for releasing music, but if you like to have a larger audience, want your music to be used for art projects movies or commercials or when you want to work with passionate people to improve your music it is still very useful to work with a label (and the network of skilled people who are associated to the label).

So how do you talk to them?

Like that. If that is not the case, time to find another label.

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I’ve been wondering about this too, my first proper EP will most likely be done by the end of the year and I think even in its current state it’s pretty decent, so I would feel comfortable showing it to labels, but I have no idea what part of the process that happens at or how to approach them. As for your situation I think a lot of labels operate basically on clout, as in they think the exposure is enough to get you interested but don’t really have a lot to actually offer in terms of elevating the release. I think this works a lot on younger artists, but like you mentioned older artists can see through it a little bit better.

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I don’t think you could pay me enough money to be making music according to what other people want to hear. That seems like a real quick way of turning something I love into something I don’t.

If a label likes your music, they can offer to release/promote it or whatever, but as soon as they start telling you what you should and shouldn’t be doing they can go fuck themselves.

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…do a little research on them…

what kind of “labels” are we talking about…?
usually, even back in the “good old days” the unwritten law was…don’t call us, we call u…
and that only happened for good reasons…
in todays “selfpromoting wonderland” good reasons would be…u are already releasing frequently in any sort of way and can obviously catch a little attention via net response of any kind…

if u already release on major streamingfarms and these “labels” picked u up from there, the big question is…what can they actually really do for U…?
it’s all about multiplication…
and if those “labels” have some level of attention and obvious multiplication factor of their own already, it might be also a reasonable option for U, to join their cake…

but if u’ve never heard of them and ur little research on them won’t proove and show any significant other story to tell, why should u bother…

because it’s ALL ABOUT CONTENT these days…
utube is activating new xtra fonds these days, because they’re also looking “desperatly” for nothing but new content creators…

and if u are a possible content creator, be aware of the fact that there’s a another next, new “gold rush” for people like U out there all over the place…

…BRANDS…that’s the bottomline to all traffic options…

and to become ur own brand or joining a brand of others becomes an everlasting essential question these days…

in sonic business it’s all about UR copyrights…
and hunting for other peoples copyrights was never that evil as it’s NOW…

if they knock at ur door to tell u what to do next is best for u, it smells pretty much like clickbaiting plans for what’s best for them…

if so, u’ll end up in an army that’s marching for their brand, with no big chances to push ur own brand any further…

yet not speaking of any royalities and how u end up in some kind of “sharing” agreement/contract which could have feed u ok, if u’d only done it on ur own, instead of giving a vast part of the cake to them…

it’s quite an old business model, to contract hundreds of creators and holding a good share on all of them…while the single creator ends up with barely nothing…

so, let them show their cards…what kind of agreements do they have in mind…
never give away ur master rights…at least aslong it’s no “big” brand where u could boost ur artist valaue of any kind and they offer any reasonable upfront pay outs…
always keep an eye on exclusive rights of all kind and for how long that would last until it would become negotiable again…

and bottom line of all is…it’s not about a label deal…it’s all about a publishing deal…

in my case for example…i had a major deal, back when majors combined already lots of fancy labels under one roof…and a publishing deal that was natural part, cause essential part of the whole deal with them…some things never change… :wink:
was not happy as an artist back then…was not happy with my conditions back then…as so many others…
nowadays…i run my own label…nothing fancy at all…a sublabel, as “they” still like to call it…
but i have an exclusive publishing deal with a “big” pro publisher “only”…
and that contract makes shure, i’ll get a good and fair share, no matter what i wanna do next…
they don’t have to push anything for me, they are nothing but a solid backend…
and THAT’S the way all content creators should aim for…
anything else is fake it til u realise u’ll never gonna make it…
so don’t let “them” fool u by sucking off all ur efforts…

and HEY, circuitghost…now that i’m thinking about it…let me SIGN U… :wink:
no strings attached…promise…ha.

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Look up other artists on the labels. If they are shit, ignore the labels

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You’re getting contacted by shitty people. Ignore them.

Labels are all bullshit these days anyway. Unless they can do something for you that you cant do yourself, for free.

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I send emails, they don’t answer, end of the conversation. easy peasy.

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These days I think it’s best to approach it similarly to how you would when negotiating for anything else that you kinda want but ultimately don’t need. Think of it like you’re haggling at the flea market.
Before you start talking to them you should already know what you want from them and what concessions you would be willing to make to get that. Those are your upper and lower thresholds. If your needs aren’t met, don’t take the deal, period.
My number one rule in haggling is to always be ready to say “nah, fuck it”, and walk away. Always.

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Well, at least one of the labels is well known and very appropriate for what I’m doing.

But I realise I’m just not into that part of it enough, to begin a relationship by guessing what they really want (since asking didn’t help much).

At a certain age, you just can’t be bothered with people who don’t know what they want and try to pin that on you.

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I think either they like what you’re doing and will release it or you are just pandering to what other people want which means why bother making music to meet someone else’s perception, what’s the fun in that. I had it myself ‘we like it but can you make a track like this’ forget it, I’m not wasting my time.