Elektron purchase headache

AdamJay · 2015-04-03T13:38:36.000Z

Tough call on which to get first. I’m not an OT fan, so my recommendation sways between A4 and Rytm.

A4:
It is true that you can make drums on A4, but unless you like real short autechrey kicks with hardly any decay, the kick is going to need its own track most of the time. Good thing is, it’s a fiercely nice sounding kick from the A4
When dedicating a Volca beats or sample for your drum work, you can make the A4 go really far with those 4 tracks. I’m consistently pleased with A4 when I let it spread its wings and not handicap its synth capabilities by losing a track or two to drums.

Rytm:
It can do great bass lines and leads from single cycle waveform samples, and has a solid compressor for a good finished sound. You have 8 voices over 12 tracks. These parts alone can make a complete song. There are limitations with doing more evolving atmospheric sounds or pads on the Rytm, due to the single LFO. I feel the Rytm get’s closer to that “complete” song in one box capability. However, my music is mostly rhythm oriented techno (and I purchased the Rytm before purchasing the A4). The combination of both scene and performance modes make it a very fun box to perform and compose live on. I can just hit record on my recorder or DAW and spend 5 minutes jamming on a main pattern with a few variations and at the end of it I have a song I can be proud of.

It probably comes down to the type of music you write, more than anything else.

Is it synth driven, with the occasional need for long evolving and atmospheric sounds, and a rich sound scape? If so, look to the A4

Is it drum & sample driven, with a need for the most realtime control of variations, and a nice finished sound? If so, look to the Rytm.

Best of luck!

Abhoth · 2015-04-03T13:54:27.000Z

I have the OT and A4, and feel the OT works really well on its own, the A4 less so. That being said, I haven’t had the A4 as long as the OT, so I might just not be proficient enough with it yet.

aldro · 2015-04-03T15:58:14.000Z

Thanks guys, much appreciated.

Regarding your comments i must say that i m not a analog/synth/drumachine champion but i have time and always try hard

I layed my eyes on a sequencer and synth for first time in Volcas, but i found them really easy and fun so i decided to go for Elektron which i have already realised that will be much more digging than Volcas.

For AR i understand that is a box on steroids and can be also further boosted up by the mighty Strom app.
On the other hand is Elektron’s latest rocket and i m wondering if that will be a maze for my head and often find myself in places that is not yet time to be there.

For A4 i can understand the limitations of tracks, abilities in live performing comparing to AR, lack of a real drum synthesis etc
On the other hand though, maybe i can fit myself better inside it’s “tight” space and get more compact results for a noob.

OT is smthg else and i feel that would be more like a decision for the future in order to be a companion for AR or A4.

Just thoughts, wish i had experienced the environment of each machine.

AdamJay · 2015-04-03T16:04:43.000Z

""aldro"":

Just thoughts, wish i had experienced the environment of each machine.

Check out Cuckoo’s A4 and Rytm tutorial videos on youtube.
They’ll give you the best virtual, realtime sense of workflow without ever touching the machine. The pace is good for getting a sense of how everything works, and where to locate import functions.

Watch them each more than once and you’ll have a real feel for how they work.

Zymos · 2015-04-03T16:15:03.000Z

I would urge you to NOT get an OT as your first Elektron box, unless sampling is a way bigger priority than anything else.

I agree with others, the order you mentioned them is what I’d go for.

aldro · 2015-04-03T16:24:11.000Z

""AdamJay"":

[quote=“aldro”]Just thoughts, wish i had experienced the environment of each machine.

Check out Cuckoo’s A4 and Rytm tutorial videos on youtube.
They’ll give you the best virtual, realtime sense of workflow without ever touching the machine. The pace is good for getting a sense of how everything works, and where to locate import functions.

Watch them each more than once and you’ll have a real feel for how they work.[/quote]
Oh yeah! i have checked them already, i found Rytm quite extensive but also tons of fun although i didnt understand some parts fully.
Dont know, i could also buy them both but i believe that i ll lose my focus.
I want to go step by step.

The music i like in terms of “structure” is this:

AdamJay · 2015-04-03T17:52:47.000Z

""aldro"":

Oh yeah! i have checked them already, i found Rytm quite extensive but also tons of fun although i didnt understand some parts fully.
Dont know, i could also buy them both but i believe that i ll lose my focus.
I want to go step by step.

The music i like in terms of “structure” is this:

Stream I Kicked A Cloud Once - B Runner by Greased Up Records | Listen online for free on SoundCloud

I highly suggest getting only one and learning it to the point you are very comfortable with it, and then getting the other.

The song you linked, Rytm could easily make that track on its own with a bit of sample prep. Lots of use of compression as an effect in that track, too, so another point for Rytm. The “Hit” function on Rytm’s compressor side chain EQ would put you in close proximity to that effect.

That song would be tough for A4. It sounds almost entirely sample based. Do you have the Volca Sample? It could take care of the drums and sampled fx bits in that song, and the A4 for recreating the sampled synth bits. But you’d need a compressor to round it all out.

aldro · 2015-04-03T21:15:41.000Z

""AdamJay"":

[quote=“aldro”]Oh yeah! i have checked them already, i found Rytm quite extensive but also tons of fun although i didnt understand some parts fully.
Dont know, i could also buy them both but i believe that i ll lose my focus.
I want to go step by step.

The music i like in terms of “structure” is this:

Stream I Kicked A Cloud Once - B Runner by Greased Up Records | Listen online for free on SoundCloud

I highly suggest getting only one and learning it to the point you are very comfortable with it, and then getting the other.

The song you linked, Rytm could easily make that track on its own with a bit of sample prep. Lots of use of compression as an effect in that track, too, so another point for Rytm. The “Hit” function on Rytm’s compressor side chain EQ would put you in close proximity to that effect.

That song would be tough for A4. It sounds almost entirely sample based. Do you have the Volca Sample? It could take care of the drums and sampled fx bits in that song, and the A4 for recreating the sampled synth bits. But you’d need a compressor to round it all out.
[/quote]
No, i do not own the white Sample buddy.

I think that in the end will be a last minute call for the Rytm or the A4 !

Thanks a lot !

Rabbitfrog · 2015-04-03T21:36:18.000Z

Octatrack!!!

Here is what it can do.
-8 tracks to load or record ANY sound including synth and drum sounds on one track.
-process external gear with effects (good use for your Volcas)
-MIDI control on 8 tracks (including your Volcas) any other synth
-extremely powerful sample engine that comes really close to a synth
-effects like bitcrush, filter, delay,reverse, pitch etc…
-add effects to any incoming audio
-turn your Octatrack into a dj mixer (4 inputs and crossfader)
-turn your Octarack into 2 dj players and mixer (load up entire CDs and mix them with effects using tracks and the crossfader)
-turn your OT into a song production station without ever powering up your PC, kicks, pads,bass (as long as you have them sampled)
-turn your OT into a sound recorder, plug your video games, CD player or vinyl player and sample and remix and edit your favorite tracks to draw inspiration without needing a computer.

I only got mine a few months ago and I love it. I also had A4 and AR before. I threw my A4 and AR in the trash, if you want them they are somewhere rotting away…

P.S. The reason I am suggesting OT is because you HAVE other synths to sample and record from, plus you can get samples anywhere these days. I think Volcas are great and Octatrack would ADD to them while AR and A4 will REPLACE them, my philosophy is to keep good stuff and only add to it and replace when the time comes.

TrabanT · 2015-04-03T21:48:40.000Z

get a used A4 or OT first… what doesnt gel will get out … in the end go for AR (fewest second hand models, hence higher prices)

I bet in the end you will end up loving all of them…

aldro · 2015-04-04T14:39:54.000Z

""TrabanT"":

get a used A4 or OT first… what doesnt gel will get out … in the end go for AR (fewest second hand models, hence higher prices)

I bet in the end you will end up loving all of them…

That’s for sure!

Definately thay all shine, i just want to choose the one that will provide me a smooth transition from the entry level Volkies to smthg more sophisticated.

The main reason i choose to buy an Elektron is also the sequencer which is so inspirational tool. Even in Volkies, i spent most of my time jiggling the sequencer to come up with new ideas. But volca’s seq is limited.

One other aspect that i take into consideration is the vast number of tutorials / tips / how to’s that are available online for the A4 and AR ( AR will have also more in the future)

For the volkies i was struggling to find smthg maybe because were too simple for someone to publish any instruction. And that is true.

Abhoth · 2015-04-04T16:14:17.000Z

I use my OT as a kind of hardware DAW. Basically it replaced a PC with Cubase. So to me the OT is the most important piece of my setup. The A4 is more ‘specialized’ imo, doing a specific task very well. So where to start is probably very much a question of what you want to do. I personally think the OT is incredibly fun and the logical device to start with. I’m actually a bit surprised to be in the minority here, even if we are in the A4 section of the forum. I don’t think you can go terribly wrong either way, though. You’re in for a ton of fun whatever device you go for.

I don’t think it is easy to ‘transition’ to the OT from other gear, though. It is a unique device that require patience to get the hang of. I don’t agree with those claiming it is complicated, it is just … different. The A4 is simpler in this respect. Particularly if you already know your way around synths in general. I don’t know the AR.

Rabbitfrog · 2015-04-04T16:25:31.000Z

You know, you say you can afford 2 machines. If I were you I would get a MonoMachine and a Machinedrum UW.

The Machinedrum UW offers sample recording unlike AR and a lot more sample manipulation. So right there you have a solid mix between AR and OT.

Monomachine offers a TON of sonic flexibility, you get similar analog sounding engines without it being of course analog plus wavetable, Sid, FM. It’s not a purist’s analog but at least you won’t go digging elsewhere when you need some variety in sound. And plus it allows to upload user waves for the wavetable synthesis.

With these two machines someone would have to really twist your arm to get more gear for a while.

Of course it all depends how you feel about this whole analog vs digital business. But I tell you if someone offered me MD UW and a MM for my A4 and AR I would not hesitate to trade.

AdamJay · 2015-04-04T17:51:45.000Z

""aldro"":

[quote=“TrabanT”]get a used A4 or OT first… what doesnt gel will get out … in the end go for AR (fewest second hand models, hence higher prices)

I bet in the end you will end up loving all of them…

That’s for sure!

Definately thay all shine, i just want to choose the one that will provide me a smooth transition from the entry level Volkies to smthg more sophisticated.

The main reason i choose to buy an Elektron is also the sequencer which is so inspirational tool. Even in Volkies, i spent most of my time jiggling the sequencer to come up with new ideas. But volca’s seq is limited.

One other aspect that i take into consideration is the vast number of tutorials / tips / how to’s that are available online for the A4 and AR ( AR will have also more in the future)

For the volkies i was struggling to find smthg maybe because were too simple for someone to publish any instruction. And that is true. [/quote]
Considering you have no sampler, I would go with a machine that has some sample playback capabilities first. i.e. AR, OT, MDUW

KOTARE · 2015-04-05T09:53:52.000Z

Based on the track you linked here, an AR - no doubt.

You’ll still need to use your computer for editing (sidechaining by individual track gain is not an option on the AR COMP, only by global EQ band), but once you hear your samples inside and on top of the analog drum synthesis, with the FX and DIST, you’ll be one happy motherfucker.

Don’t get an A4 - everything will sound samey. In my experience, owning an OT, AK, and AR, and having owned an MD and MM, you want an AR. Second option would be an OT, but you will lose girth and raw power (which is what I hear in this song anyways)

My $0.02.

KOTARE · 2015-04-05T09:57:02.000Z

A VERY good 2nd option, now that I think of it, would be an OT and a 404sx. I use that combo and it is fucking badass - the 404 crisp sound (a staple in the track style you linked) with the OT’s sequencer, FX, and mixing ability (not to mention looping and recording abilities…)

You won’t get those analog balls but maybe you work towards a separate piece later on with OT as your brain/hub?

Huck_Farper · 2015-04-05T10:03:05.000Z

I own, A4, MD, Octatrack.

Get an Octatrack. It’s the daddy Elektron.

You can turn those volcas into an oasis of source sounds to feed it.

huuper · 2015-04-05T10:11:56.000Z

I’ve owned at one point or another every Elektron machine (excluding the SidStation) and I think you should get the Octatrack.

Everyone always says it’s difficult or confusing but it really isn’t. You can mangle samples to infinity, process external audio, and midi sequence other gear. It’s easy to quickly get a groove going with it, but will take a lot of experience to truly master all aspects of it. Considering you already have the Volcas it’s a no-brainer for me. It also pairs well with literally any other Elektron machine if you get a second one like you’re planning on.

I thought I could replace my Octatrack with Rytm because it can play samples, but it’s so much more of a hassle to use them on the Rytm than the OT. When considering the Rytm, don’t give it too much credit for it’s sample playback ability.

KOTARE · 2015-04-05T10:54:58.000Z

Actually, the AR smokes the OT for one shot samples. It has vibes in abundance, ESPECIALLY for the styles of music on the label you linked to.

But it’s pretty useless at sample manipulation (beyond what a volca can do) and, well everything else to do with samples… but you will want, based on your track, a piece which has raw vibes. For that I’d sell the volca, get a 404, and pair that with an OT.

The OT is amazing, but sonically it doesn’t have balls. People will disagree with that - chances are that they don’t make the kind of music you are looking to make. I do, so I’d weigh up other people’s perspective with a grain of sand.

The OT and the 404sx, you’ll be set.

KOTARE · 2015-04-05T11:02:33.000Z

Also, the OT doesn’t take long to learn, but only if you go into it knowing what you want it to do, step by step, in advance.

It’s very easy to get it triggering samples (it’ll trigger all 120 samples on the 404 via two MIDI channels, for example…) You can have a 64 step sequence playing an external sampler or synth in 15 minutes as a total beginner.

It’s very easy to pass the 404 audio through the inputs and put FX on the sound.

It’s easy to set up tracks to playback samples internally (and a hell of a lot of fun).

Recording into it requires a clear head to learn though.

What the OT does to new people is subvert their music vision due to the random things it can do. This is often awesome, but also slows down your learning time as you can easily get sidetracked.