Deluge vs A4

Nereo · 2024-04-10T20:50:18.679Z

darenager:

Completely different beasts, Deluge could probably do some similar sounds to A4, but they would be nowhere near as dynamic, way less modulation options.

But it sounds like you want a multitimbral polyphonic synth, rather than a 4 voice highly modulatable analog synth, which the Deluge can do.

The synth engines on the Deluge are a little limited when compared to a full blown synth, but they are perfectly capable of most types of sound, especially since the community firmwares.

I have both and really like both.

Well, that’s why I haven’t found a synth that could replace the A4. I really love the highly modulating feature of that synth! and the fact that has digital controls let you perform very much with easy, recalling and sorting all sort of parameters.
How cool that you own both!

Matoshi · 2024-04-10T20:50:38.707Z

Nereo:

that I find the synth engines of the A4 not so powerful

If you’re struggling to get sounds you like with A4 maybe something more immediate would be an idea? Digitone is a good option that someone else mentioned, FM is odd but there are loads of nice patches available from Elektron and others. Arturia Minifreak is also great - super flexible, covers every kind of synthesis so far invented (more or less).

Nereo · 2024-04-10T20:51:24.619Z

bodymechanics:

Nereo:

On top of that I find the synth engines of the A4 not so powerful and I find it a pity that you can’t sequence midi either…

It sequences midi. Maybe update the OS?
The A4’s sweet spots are not as broad or obvious, you have to hunt for them.
However it’s extremely rewarding when you find out what makes the A4 unique

Really?!! It can sequence external gears through midi? Didn’t know of that at all!
Thanks for sharing your opinion. Very much appreciated! [

Nereo · 2024-04-10T20:59:20.516Z

LyingDalai:

Nereo:

I’m looking for a multitimbral polyphonic synth, and A4 isn’t any of the two.
On top of that I find the synth engines of the A4 not so powerful and I find it a pity that you can’t sequence midi either…

I see what you mean but it’s multitimbral, polyphonic, pretty powerful and you can sequence midi.
Maybe not as you’d like it, granted. It’s a particular beast IMO. The Performance macros give nice control for a live session. The crazy Pattern jump is something I especially appreciate.

Digitone may be a better fit, if you’re keen on the Elektron sequencer.

Anyway, with the open source OS the Deluge seems a very nice box, definitely. Always evolving.
A friend of mine tells me it’s the ultimate desert island groovebox. Seems very good for live performance.
You won’t get the analog roar and it make take some time to tame but I don’t think you’ll be disappointed by the Deluge.

You’re right! Indeed the best macros control for live!
I love particularly the controls you can have on arpeggios, the arpeggiator it self and all the options you can have with the sequencer. And I really like the Elektron workflow.
I’ve considered the Digitone for a moment, but FM isn’t really my thing. And that seems to be merely based on FM synthesis isn’t it?

Matoshi · 2024-04-10T21:01:24.859Z

Oh, and Roland SH 4d. I think that is multitimbral but with 4 polysynths at the same time. I don’t have one but it seems well liked.

Nereo · 2024-04-10T21:05:19.270Z

Matoshi:

Nereo:

that I find the synth engines of the A4 not so powerful

If you’re struggling to get sounds you like with A4 maybe something more immediate would be an idea? Digitone is a good option that someone else mentioned, FM is odd but there are loads of nice patches available from Elektron and others. Arturia Minifreak is also great - super flexible, covers every kind of synthesis so far invented (more or less).

Thought about the Digitone has I’d prefer to stay “Elektron”… But FM isn’t really my thing.
Minifreak could be cool, since I also love the sounds of the Microfreak. But it’s too big and chunky for live performances sorry… wanna stay on the portable side of things. Also because what I do is a mixture of acoustic and electronics music.
Something like that to give an example…
https://www.instagram.com/reel/CvPYUWvKz1J/?igsh=cnh0N3A1bmJkYTRp

Nereo · 2024-04-10T21:07:44.190Z

Matoshi:

Oh, and Roland SH 4d. I think that is multitimbral but with 4 polysynths at the same time. I don’t have one but it seems well liked.

I’ve given a listen on the YouTube demos. Sounded a bit too 80s/90s IMO?.. Or am I completely wrong?

Matoshi · 2024-04-10T21:31:10.764Z

Nereo:

Sounded a bit too 80s/90s IMO?.. Or am I completely wrong?

You’re completely right! I think it has a number of oscillator types but most of the yt demos seem to make it sound like a Juno.

LyingDalai · 2024-04-11T06:27:21.569Z

Nereo:

FM isn’t really my thing

Maybe that’s the part you should work on
It’s a path well worth considering.

my own path

I used to hate FM. I blame the 80’s.
After some tries on A4 I was not convinced, maybe intrigued at best.
Then I read a blog about it that was putting things very simply (check the Tao of FM synthesis), figured I liked some music heavily relying on FM, so I have looked for a simple FM synth to explore what this was all about, and right then the Digitone appeared.

Here are a few tricks:

Your approach to FM synthesis? - #24 by LyingDalai

Mies_van_der_Robot · 2024-04-11T12:06:03.664Z

Does it need to have an on-board sequencer? Your options would broaden considerably if you’re willing to separate synth & sequencer.

I haven’t owned a Deluge, but compared to the A4 (which I have), I’ve found what I’ve heard of its synth engines fairly uninspiring. The grid-based sequencer/workflow is what Deluge fans rave about, not the synths.

In your shoes, I’d be thinking about pairing a sequencer with good polyphonic support (chord modes, scale quantization, etc) with a nice multitimbral polysynth desktop module. Say, an Oxi One and a GS Music e7. Or (cheaper option) a Squarp Pyramid and a Micromonsta 2.

Nereo · 2024-04-11T12:37:13.985Z

LyingDalai:

Nereo:

FM isn’t really my thing

Maybe that’s the part you should work on
It’s a path well worth considering.

my own path

I used to hate FM. I blame the 80’s.
After some tries on A4 I was not convinced, maybe intrigued at best.
Then I read a blog about it that was putting things very simply (check the Tao of FM synthesis), figured I liked some music heavily relying on FM, so I have looked for a simple FM synth to explore what this was all about, and right then the Digitone appeared.

Here are a few tricks:

Your approach to FM synthesis? - #24 by LyingDalai

Interesting point you have there. I’ll check your link with full curiosity. Thanks a lot!

LyingDalai · 2024-04-11T13:10:26.797Z

I know.
“I don’t like FM” ⇒ “check FM”
is kind of a misplaced injunction…

BUT...

image854×638 125 KB

And @Ess’ own favorite
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d6bJVcmFaNk&t=104s

Nereo · 2024-04-11T13:14:27.063Z

Mies_van_der_Robot:

Does it need to have an on-board sequencer? Your options would broaden considerably if you’re willing to separate synth & sequencer.

I haven’t owned a Deluge, but compared to the A4 (which I have), I’ve found what I’ve heard of its synth engines fairly uninspiring. The grid-based sequencer/workflow is what Deluge fans rave about, not the synths.

In your shoes, I’d be thinking about pairing a sequencer with good polyphonic support (chord modes, scale quantization, etc) with a nice multitimbral polysynth desktop module. Say, an Oxi One and a GS Music e7. Or (cheaper option) a Squarp Pyramid and a Micromonsta 2.

Hey Mies!
Thank you so much for your input! Very much appreciated!
You got exactly my point! no need for a on-board sequencer as I already owe an oxi one and quite happy with it.
The thing about the Deluge that are attractive to me are: portability, in-built speaker and the fact that is battery powered, and seems to be a unique machine all in one and it is multitimbral, so I could, if I wanted, just perform with one machine.
Though sound engines are very important to me!

Actually the Micromonsta 2 seems to be EXTREMELY interesting! From what I’ve checked on YT so far it sounds REAALLY impressive! That’s a kind of sound I’d look for! Don’t care about the rest. But that + the oxi one should really do for me… It’s smaller than a Digitakt! Amazing!
The only BIG problem is … THAT IS SOLD OUT since December 2023!
Fingers crossed it will be available quite soon.
PS. From your nick name I was wondering if you’re Dutch? (I live in the NL)

Mies_van_der_Robot · 2024-04-11T15:56:51.689Z

Nereo:

Actually the Micromonsta 2 seems to be EXTREMELY interesting! From what I’ve checked on YT so far it sounds REAALLY impressive! That’s a kind of sound I’d look for! Don’t care about the rest. But that + the oxi one should really do for me… It’s smaller than a Digitakt! Amazing!

Yeah, it has impressively big sound for such a small device!

The only BIG problem is … THAT IS SOLD OUT since December 2023!

Last year, people were reporting a wait of about 6-12 months between joining the email list and receiving an invitation to order. Hopefully, that trend will continue. I’m waiting for one myself. I console myself with the realization that they are so non-existent in the aftermarket because people love them once they finally get them!

PS. From your nick name I was wondering if you’re Dutch? (I live in the NL

Not by nationality, but I’m partly Dutch by heritage.

However, my forum nickname is a wordplay on Mies van der Rohe, who was actually German. He took the “van der” styling from Dutch because he legally couldn’t use “von” since he wasn’t descended from German nobility. So he used “van der” instead to give his name some fake aristocratic clout when he became an architect. Pretty clever.

Nereo · 2024-04-11T21:19:22.505Z

Mies_van_der_Robot:

Yeah, it has impressively big sound for such a small device!

Pretty amazing indeed!

Mies_van_der_Robot:

Last year, people were reporting a wait of about 6-12 months between joining the email list and receiving an invitation to order. Hopefully, that trend will continue. I’m waiting for one myself. I console myself with the realization that they are so non-existent in the aftermarket because people love them once they finally get them!

JEEEEEEZ! Pretty damn long waiting list! How long have you been waiting yourself so far?

Mies_van_der_Robot:

Not by nationality, but I’m partly Dutch by heritage.

However, my forum nickname is a wordplay on Mies van der Rohe, who was actually German. He took the “van der” styling from Dutch because he legally couldn’t use “von” since he wasn’t descended from German nobility. So he used “van der” instead to give his name some fake aristocratic clout when he became an architect. Pretty clever.

Hahahaha! Funny story! Clever indeed!

Starscream · 2024-04-12T03:49:48.041Z

Had both at one point in time and Deluge stayed. One is analogue the other isn’t. Beyond that I would think sound engine wise, A4 has a more direct and impactful punch. The tweakability and macro effects are so good but requires pre planning and configuration. Deluge ain’t a slouch either. With community firmware update Deluge now offers clip launching and live remixing in a very performance friendly way. Prior to this I would say the Elektron workflow is fastest to deploy and perform. Now it’s pretty even and more a matter of style and choice by users.

RonCavagnaro · 2024-04-12T16:21:02.231Z

I’ve had both and deluge stayed.

Way different gear. If you have to choose up to you but I’d never get rid of deluge , it is the best thing ever. Soundwise it is great but it also works great with midi out!

Nereo · 2024-04-22T17:17:50.283Z

In your shoes, I’d be thinking about pairing a sequencer with good polyphonic support (chord modes, scale quantization, etc) with a nice multitimbral polysynth desktop module. Say, an Oxi One and a GS Music e7. Or (cheaper option) a Squarp Pyramid and a Micromonsta 2.
[/quote]

I was lucky enough to have found a second hand Micromonsta 2
If I understood correctly the Micromonsta 2 is bitimbral right?
But how can select the two different midi channels for the two banks? I didn’t find out that. I can only select on midi channels somehow. Checked the manual as well but no luck… Any clue?

Mies_van_der_Robot · 2024-04-22T17:23:14.904Z

It’s in the manual in the Modes chapter:

Program A is accessed on main MIDI channel (the one set in SYSTEM menu), while Program B is accessed on main MIDI channel + 1.

Nereo · 2024-04-22T21:14:42.507Z

Thank you! It took me a while to figure out what that “main midi channel + 1” meant, but now is all good. Thanks a lot!