You are missing a value:
0xf0 0x00 0x20 0x3c 0x0d 0x00 0x6b 0x01 0x01 track_number_here 0x00 0x00 0x00 0x05 0xf7
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Hello @mekohler !
I didn’t see your answer before. And it is working !!! Thanks a lot for your reply. It’s really a huge step for me to have this working !
Thanks again !
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Hello,
May be it can help someone.
I found the way Ratio B is encoded in the sysex sound patch dump.
On a midi level, Ratio B is encoded with CC16 and CC48 and covers a range of values from 0 to 360.
- 0 when CC16 =0 and CC48 = 0 (minimum values)
- 360 when CC16 = 2 and CC48 = 104 (maximum values)
On a sysex level :
The sysex sound patch dump is composed of 339 bytes that I put (converted into decimal) in an array : sysex[0] to sysex [338]
Ratio B is encoded with 3 bytes using sysex[82], sysex [88] and sysex [89].
And here is the formula I found :
Int ( (sysex[82] x 64) + (sysex[88] x 128) + (sysex[89] / 2) ) = range from 0 to 360
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Hi guys,
I think I found something interesting about the way that different parameters share the same sysex location (cf question of @mekohler )
Harmonics is encoded using sysex[90], sysex[91] and sysex[92]
Detune is encoded using sysex[90], sysex[93] and sysex[94]
So the 2 parameters shares the value sysex[90]
What I found is that if you convert sysex[90] into binary, it can be seen as a binary switch. The same switches you can find on some synth to select the midi channel.
sysex[90] can be written b128 b64 b32 b16 b8 b4 b2 b1 and each of these bits can have a value of 1 or 0
If b32 = 1, it modify the way Harmonics is calculated. If b8 = 1, it modifies the way Detune is calculated and of course you can have both b32 and b8 = 1 but b32 only affects Harmonics and b8, Detune.
So here are the formula found :
Harmonics
if b32 of sysex[90]= 0
Harmonics value ={ [((sysex[91]x128) + Int(sysex[92]/2) - 4736 ) x
(5201/6657) ] -2600 } / 100
if b32 of sysex[90]= 1
Harmonics value ={ [((sysex[91]x128) + Int((sysex[92]+128)/2) - 4736 ) x
(5201/6657) ] -2600 } / 100
Detune
if b8 of sysex[90]= 0
Detune value = [ (sysex[93]x128) + Int(sysex[94]/2) ] x 127/16256
if b8 of sysex[90]= 1
Detune value = [ (sysex[93]x128) + Int((sysex[94]+128)/2) ] x 127/16256
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I have been playing around with your Python code for the past couple of days and reading your documentation and discoveries. Thanks very much for the work you have done. I probably wouldn’t get anywhere or even start without your work.
If anyone is still interested in the subject, I think I have figured out the root cause of a few quirks, especially with regards to tags and name (which is my focus)
You have covered the subject of 7-bit Encoding of data in your documentation, but I’m not sure why you haven’t applied this to your implementation. The peculiar pattern of the tag bit flags and the random/incorrect characters in the name both can be associated to this.
Impact on Tags
Here is a representation of the bits for the first 8 tags:
22222222 22222222 11111111 11111111 00000000 00000000
FEDCBA98 76543210 FEDCBA98 76543210 FEDCBA98 76543210
KICK: -------- -----●-- -------- -------- -------- -------●
SNAR: -------- -----●-- -------- -------- -------- ------●-
DEEP: -------- -----●-- -------- -------- -------- -----●--
BRAS: -------- -----●-- -------- -------- -------- ----●---
STRI: -------- -----●-- -------- -------- -------- ---●----
PERC: -------- -----●-- -------- -------- -------- --●-----
HHAT: -------- -----●-- -------- -------- -------- -●------
CYMB: -----●-- -----●-- -------- -------- -------- --------
The key observation is that the bytes 0x12 (i.e. 28…2F above) actually contains the MSBs of the following 7 bytes. Therefore, the bit set for “CYMB” in 0x12 is really the MSB of 0x17 (i.e. 07 above). That means that a sequence of 32 consecutive bits are used to represent flags in the non-encoded representation.
Impact on Name
The fourth patch in Digitone’s Bank A is named:
PLUCKY EÅ
However, mere UTF-8 decoding of the byte data yields:
PL.UCKY EE
Here are the corresponding bytes:
50 4C 01 55 43 4B 59 20 45 45
Note that byte 0x01 above contains the MSBs of next 7 bytes. So the last character is not “E” (01000101), but rather “Å” (11000101)
The MSBs of the first two characters are actually in byte 0x12.
I’m completely new to SysEx and not that experienced with Python, but I’m working my way through both. I’m hoping to build a tool for managing sound names/tags more easily on the computer.
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This is fantastic! Thanks much. I feel like I was working through this back when I was still active on the project and may have something similar to it on a local copy. I lost interest in the project due to school ramping up and the release of Overbridge for the digitone.
My original plan was to make a neural net that created patches, but I don’t think it would work very well unless I made an ungodly amount of patches by hand for the nn to work through. Since the actual human readable name of the tag wouldn’t be as important as just identifying the tag field, I probably got fast and loose with that detail.
If you wanted to add this to the repo, make a pull request and let me know and I can put your contribution in. The next thing I would need to do here is to identify the bits that got added with the operator microtuning update in OS 1.2(1?).
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From this thread and your documentation I realized your focus was on doing more interesting things with the patches. But my needs are much more simple and mundane.
Basically, given the huge number of sounds available, and the fact that the factory tag applications don’t seem accurate (as brought up here), I needed an easy way to re-tag sounds to make them more useful. And unfortunately Overbridge or Transfer don’t provide any way for managing sounds on the computer. I hope they add this capability.
For now, my plan is to export the current state in CSV format, use another application to edit the CSV, and feed the modified CSV file back into my tool and apply the changes.
I’ll see if I can submit parts of my code back to your repository. But currently I’ve just implemented something from scratch for simplicity.
By the way, I just finished implementing the 7-bit decoding for the data portion of the message (based on the formula you had documented), and the results confirm what I described earlier.
One additional thing I realized is that the name encoding is actually “Latin-1”, not “UTF-8”
I will post an update when I have something useful to share.
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I just finished the implementation. You can find it here:
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Hey, I’m wondering if you’ve ever looked into project structure in digitone?
I’m currently looking at the digitakt and some wierdness in the message has me confused.
When I dump a project, I get 129 messages.
The first 128 all start with:
F0 00 20 3C 0A 00 50 01 01 {00-7F}
Where {00-7F} I assume is the pattern number.
This to me looks like the same thing you found in your docs here:
However the final message starts
F0 00 20 3C 0A 00 54 01 01 00
Now the thing is, I’m not sure if this last message is the project settings, or if that would be the first one (I originally assumed the first message was project settings)
It’s strange because 54 suggests a different model ID based on your table, however based on other docs, http://www.2writers.com/eddie/tutsysex.htm
I’m thinking 54 01 01 is actually the “address” it’s writing to and the MODEL ID is just “0A 00” (or “0D 00” in the case of digitone)
What do you think? I’m only just starting to look into all this as I’m trying to see if I can recover a corrupted sysex project from digitakt as I only need 2 or 3 of the patterns.
Yer avatar…that building in Vancouver?
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Isn’t the sysex Model ID usually just one byte?
I think this is about decoding the sysex for sound dumps, not projects or patterns.
layout of the SysEx message for Digitone sounds
But this might be a good starting point to understand the project sysex better.
So, I think the final message could just be an identifier for the type of sysex data. An adress, like you say, could also make sense since that data is obviously not stored in the same place as sound data.
I never made it far into the project sysex data, since there is far too much going on. IIRC, I got the model ID information from the Rytm library, so I didn’t do much work to verify past what the digitone looked like compared to that. What your saying makes sense, but I’m far too removed from this project to answer concretely. My guess would be that the 53/54 discrepancy is there to tell the device what kind of message to expect.
I’ve never had the pleasure to dive too deeply into a digitakt, so I’m not sure how much overlap there would be between the two. Best of luck!
thanks! 
so it does look like the first 128 messages are patterns and the last one is project settings.
I was able to fix a corrupted project file which was what I was mainly trying to do.
I managed to make the patterns works but the tracks all point to empty sample slots, this is enough for me as I can hopefully try to rebuild the patterns with new sounds, having the plocks and trigs there is a good start!
I’ll probs dive into the projects again for DT to see if I can figure out how the samples are referenced, ideally I’d like to make a 1 button script to backup a digitakt project + all associated samples.
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The elk herd project already has this figured out I think. I’ve put in a feature request to have a “collect and save all” function added to save me redoing stuff that has already been figured out haha! But obv no expectations on anyone else’s time or anything so ill proba chip away at it
Hey. Sorry, I just got a chance to read your post. Seems you’ve already managed to do what you were trying to.
I must say that my focus was very narrow. I was basically focused on Digitone patches, and only the tags and title information in the patches. So I don’t really have any insights on the project data especially on Digitakt.
However, regarding the manufacturer/model ID, I must say that I did quite a bit of research, and while I don’t remember all the details now, I was pretty confident that I had figured it out at the time.
I’m certain that “00 20 3C” is Elektron’s manufacturer ID, but I’m not too sure about “0D 00 53 01 01” as model ID. But what mattered to me was that it was constant, and it was not part of the “data” portion of the SysEx message. Therefore, it didn’t really matter to my work. It’s all just a constant “header”.
I remember a general PDF document about SysEx message structure in general mentioning that some manufacturers include the MIDI port numbers as part of the model ID, so that if you have multiple instances of the same device in a setup, you still get a unique model ID per unit. I’m not sure if I understood that correctly, and never ran any tests to see Elektron does anything like that.
well spotted! 
Hey guys splendid work here to reverse engineer the sysex messages.
I am building a max msp midi editor and I need to read the values of the fx and the trig page form the sysex pattern data.
I am trying to send a sysex request for the pattern data without the sound data.
I have been able to figure out the sysex message request for current sound(byte 9 specified track) and current pattern or specified in byte 9 pattern.
The pattern sysex massages very are large and I am wondering if anybody figured out how to request the pattern data only.
Thx in advance
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It’s been a long time since I have put into this project, but most of the information I was working off of was in the monomachine manual. The best path forward would be attempt the call from there.There is a pattern dump request in the sysex implementation. You’ll need to change the SYSEX INIT to have the digitone sysex prefix from the code base.
SYSEX pattern dump:
MIDI Byte | Purpose
------------+----------------------------
(SYSEX init)|
$67 | Pattern dump ID
... | Pattern data bytes (see separate
| documentation)
$f7 | SYSEX end
SYSEX pattern dump request:
MIDI Byte | Purpose
------------+----------------------------
(SYSEX init)|
$68 | Pattern request ID
%0aaaaaaa | Send pattern %aaaaaaa
$f7 | SYSEX end
Hope this helps, best of luck!
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I’m very interested.
Also for pattern generation, using sysex.
Is there a place where we can have the sysex structure or whatever about that?