Compressor settings

Elektron Gear Analog Rytm
#31

I think itā€™s a semantic problem.

VOL is probably output volume of DRY (uncompressed) sound.
Make up gain and compressor output are the same thing. the only difference that usually, make up gain is scaled differently.

Yeah, by playing around with it I confirmed this.
The VOL is dealing with DRY uncompressed sound.
You can tell because when you lower it all the way, the compressor is still compressing. You cannot hear anything because the compressor output is down.

The output is really just an ATTENUATOR where 127 is Unity gain.
Itā€™s also can be used to further refine how much dry signal is fed into the Mix knob. So ultimately, itā€™s just one more control to use when setting up gain.

Itā€™s confusing a little but itā€™s definitely not reacting with the compressor.

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#32

Very interesting thread.
Thanks teomi for explaining in a very clear way!

Now: there is no magical setup for a compressor, but is possible to get ā€œtemplate setupā€ that are known to work well after a little tweak. I dunno, for example one for Filter House, one for drum n bassā€¦or maybe a different classificationā€¦you got the idea.

#33

Sure!

Templates are always a good thing :slight_smile:

#34

Thanks again BTW!

Now Iā€™m totally confused - this is from the manual which alludes to the VOL being the compressed output. Iā€™m inferring this statement from their explanation of the MIX control:

MIX (Dry/Wet Mix) sets the mix of the uncompressed signal and
the compressor output signal. The left extreme setting results in a completely uncompressed signal. The extreme right setting lets only the compressed signal pass through. All values in between mix the uncompressed signal with the compressed signal, also known as parallel compression. A definitive Motown compression effect may be achieved at moderate MIX settings combined with high RAT and low MUP settings. Range (0-127).

[b]VOL /b sets the volume of the output signal. Range (0-127).

#35

Ultimately, the VOL is the compressor output AFTER the compression.
You can clearly hear it if you heavily compress a Kick and then lower the VOL. The compressor is still compressing but the volume drops and if there wad any saturation, itā€™s now gone.

Itā€™s a way for you to control the final gain of the compressor without altering the compression.

Itā€™s just another gain stage control. Usually compressors donā€™t have 2 separate output controls. The Makeup gain is often the output.

Just use it in combination with everything else. Itā€™s not going to alter the compression that is already applied to the incoming signal.

Eitan

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#36

So please share your compressor templates :stuck_out_tongue_winking_eye:

#37

:slight_smile: I really donā€™t have any.

I usually start with 3:1 ratio and work with the Threshold to find the sweet spot where compression begins.
Depending on the frequency of the material and how dense the material is, I set the attack and release.

Slower attack is actually better to achieve Punch or to ā€œhearā€ the sound of the compressor.

If you want to crush it, than fast attack is better.

Release time depends on the tempo. If itā€™s too slow, the compressor will compress and stay thereā€¦if itā€™s too fast then the compressor will pump.

Working with the RYTM I noticed that Parallel compression gives the best results because the Compressor is very aggressive.

Hope this helps.
Eitan

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#38

Thanks! This is making a lot more sense to me. I agree, the MIX control is where itā€™s at right now.

#39

Thanks Teomi for nice explanation.

Sorry for discussion the manual here, but I do not understand the comp SEQ.
My template setting is current setting everything at 12 oā€™clock, attack 3 ms, release A1ā€¦this is at approx. 120 BPMā€¦standard techno rytm. I use the rytm as my master bus.

But I turn the SEQ off. Mainly because I donā€™t understand what it does. Also the manual (see below) doensā€™t make it clear for me.

Can someone explain how it is used best and what for?

Is it so that you should only use the SEQ if you also apply separate out?

SEQ (Sidechain EQ) filters the signal before it is analyzed by the compressor in one of the following ways: ā€¢ OFF lets the sidechain signal remain unchanged. ā€¢ LPF lowpass filters the signal prior to analysis, making the compressor react mostly to the bass. Use this setting for a characteristic pumping compressor sound. ā€¢ HPF passes the signal through a highpass filter before it is analyzed, making the compressor react less to the bass. Use this setting to avoid pumping. ā€¢ HIT results in a balanced equalization of the sidechain signal, making the compressor react similarly to all frequencies of the signal.

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#40

One thing about the VOL parameter that I noticed is that the send effects remain unchanged when you turn VOL.

It makes for a convenient way to set the dry/send levels ratio. I find the reverb to be too low in volume in many cases, so I use the VOL parameter to make it louder, relatively.

You need to use the Master Volume knob to compensate for the volume reduction, though.

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#41

I believe you can also set the reverb to pre rather than post on the Dist page, no?

#42

Itā€™s not about separate outs, itā€™s about which part of the Rytmā€™s signal triggers the Rytmā€™s compressor:
OFF - all of it
LPF - only lows
HPF - only highs
HIT - transients
You see?

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#43

Thanks @teomi for these explanations.

I have two questions following on what you wrote:

  • Iā€™ve often read one should start jamming with a compressor on the master since the very beginning of the composition process. The reason is so that the final treatment doesnā€™t destroy the initial groove. Does this hold or is it better to master-compress once the track is done and the final dynamics are there?

  • Am I then right to conclude I should have different compressor settings on each of my Rytmā€™s banks? So in a live for example, my compressor settings will change progressively as I switch between banks (or kits to be more precise).

#44

Here is my opinion which may be sound purist:

  1. I never use a Compressor as part of my default compositional process. Unless Iā€™m going for a specific sound that requires using a Compressor as an effect, I never stick a Compressor on the master by default.

  2. Yes, ideally you will match the setting of your compressor based on the sound you are producing. You cannot assume that a compressor will sound good across different program materials just because itā€™s there. Of course gentler settings can translate across a more diverse program material but I find that everything needs to be refined one way or another.

Remember a compressor is not a Limiter - using a Limiter you may find that it can be used as a utility to avoid peaks, for instance.

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#45

Just thought about that ā€œcomp settings explode upon muting kickā€ prob. I suggest that you use a perf macro for muting the kick instead (vol to as much minus that you can), while simultaneously lovering the comp level to compensate. Hmm you could do this with a scene too I imagine?

btw, thanks for the ā€œplock and slideā€ tips KOTARE! Will experiment with this later on, should be good :heat:

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#46

I always use these settings

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#47

I have a simple trick for Enhancing Transcients : I put ratio max, pull threshold max downā€¦ then you find the attack value who let the transcients pass ā€¦ (but on the transcients no full sound) then you come back to more natural value on the treshold and ratio. Simple and effective isnā€™t it ?

  1. Taming Transients: Fast Attack + Fast Release + High Threshold
  2. Enhancing Transients: Medium attack + Synchronized release + High threshold
  3. Transparent Dynamic Range Reduction: Low threshold + Low Ratio
  4. Lengthening Sustain: Conventional Upwards Compression
  5. Upwards Compression: Downwards Compression + Gain

I also use Parallel compression : itā€™s a very agressive compression and thatā€™s, is mixed (with Dry/Wet knob) to the natural signal so you find you balance and get something punchy but just whatā€™s needed ā€¦ to your taste.

If you want something RAW, you should avoid compression in anyway. And use more tape saturation (& Distortion) and transcient shaper + EQing instead and sound-design in the context of the track AND not isolated sound focus design

ā€¦
@void
Jean Claude Vandamme : No need for a flash when youā€™re a photographer and take a white rabit who already have the red eyesā€¦

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#48

I totally see what a compressor does to a single track, and even what each parameter does (or I think I do).

What is hard for me is to picture what it does to several tracks at the same time.
One can use filters so that compression is triggered e.g. only on bass but otherwise I still donā€™t have a clear view what one would use the compressor on the whole signal forā€¦

I still have to re-read this thread in its entirety, I have to confess :smile_cat:

#49

See I thought I understood but now youā€™re making me doubt againā€¦ :drunk:

If only we had thought-compressors!

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#50

BTW the most interesting lesson I learned when trying to understand what the compressor does was realizing I was always every volume to the MAX most of the time.
Err, Iā€™m still a guitarist, at timesā€¦

So first trying to keep some headroom revealed to be very useful.
And also trying to lower all the sounds but the one I wanted louder was a better way to do than going to eleven.
And also looking for the biggest evil bass/kick ever wasnā€™t going to make the better mix.

In fact, I realized that every time I had been playing in a band as a guitarist someone told me I was too loudā€¦ Which I was totally disagreeing at that timeā€¦

Anyway, before knowing the principles of compression, I found it was mandatory to know a little bit more on setting the right levels for each track. Which is called ā€œmixingā€, I think :wink:

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