Ask Elektron if they can implement that through a firmware update then. We never know!
Cannot test it with scientific method right now, but isn’t it rounded by Attack and Release?
EDIT
it is…so even if too fast reacting to incoming signal it can be smoothed out
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Did back then.
Also suggested a performance mode (with possibilty to limit amounts of for example resonance. to not blow up ears by chance)
A bit more focus on such things would make it much more than a distortion unit with extras.
There is a real need on the market for good stereo filters. There’s pretty much nothing that’s available second hand cheaper than a new AH.
But since we still don’t have a stable Overbridge and 6 new products (if you count the MK2s) since my hopes are quite limited.
I tried to show the AH with Overbridge to a mate who’s on Cubase a few months ago. Embarrassing audio dropouts… I emailed Elektron about it and the answer was: yeah Cubase still does not work well with overbridge…
But well it’s February now. Let’s see what the new version will bring…
Sorry for venting my feelings, I love the AH, but it could be so much more (that i want) so easy… 
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Yeah Attack/Release can help, but also those i find quite unpredictable and with a narrow sweet spot.
to give you an idea what i mean,
i wrote this a year ago to the elektron support to suggest to give “trig” a function:
…Still don’t not really understand why the gain is being trigger also when there is a separate Trig-pot, because i find with gain it distorts short after getting “in the zone”.
I gave the Heat a bit of a shootout against the Softube “Mutronics Mutator” Plugin with some disco-loops.
The Heat’s filter sounds a million times better - but the Mutator grooves pretty much in any setting as soon as i dial in the ENV Follower.
With the Heat I hardly get to similar results.
In AR mode the results are somehow too drastic & not funky.
in FLW mode i was closest (as you can hear on the MP3 attached),
but seem not to be able to adjust to get the effect really grooving.
Was hoping the TRIG could be the missing link here…
Obviously I was only using one side of the Mutator and without the VCA being active, even without LFO for now.
Sound example:
0:00-0:04: Mutator Filtered Loop, no ENV
0:04-0:08: Heat Filtered Loop, no ENV
0:08-0:24: Mutator not touching Freq or Res, ENV sweep down to -5, adjusting Sens, A+R
0:24-1:02: Heat FLW-Mode, not touching Freq, turing Filter ENV down to -90, adjusting Gain, A+R, Resonance
…they both do similar things, but the Mutator sounds smooth, the Heat somehow mechanic.
If you have any suggestions on better settings i would be very thankful.
their answer was quite surprising:
This sounds pretty on par with what you can expect to get out of more complex material when
using the follower. It works much better on less layered sounds. The only thing I could
recommend is to try adjust the follower filter a bit to change how it responds to the incoming signal.
[…]
In all honesty, I think it is a bit unfair to compare the Heat to a plugin that can smooth out the
resulting follower curve in a much higher resolution that what we are technically able to do with our platform.
(And also have a look-ahead)
Perhaps the original Mutator has a much more in-depth envelope follower as well.
Ours is quite brutal in a way, but does the trick well anyway. It’s actually an analog/digital
hybrid envelope detector which is quite interesting in itself.
…if you have any suggestions how to get smoother results you are very welcome. #PresetSwap ?
PS: Listening back now: I think I had too much Resonance on the AH.
but I think it still demonstrates the different sound/feel of the 2 Followers
Premise: I have not tried the Mutator (SW neither HW) ever.
But I do believe an enormous difference is made by the ENV SWEEP which misses in AH.
Might you try using the LFO (in TRIG mode) to alter a bit the Follower’s depth on cutoff or the cutoff itself?
Or other combinations…I strongly feel that AH is far more flexible than Mutator…
on LFO you still have Fade and Start parameters to play with.
Env Sweep in Mutador = Env Depth in Heat ! No?
Also, there is no trigger level for the envelope follower in Mutador!
And it seems that the Heat as much more parameters to play with.
… like narrowing the frequency band of the envelope follower
I know what you say, even if AH and Mutator have different “topology” and AH has different Env Depths (please, pass me on this) since we can choose Envelope’s destinations (which doesn’t happen on Mutator).
If I was requested to compare the two though…I would say that SENS on Mutator is our incoming Gain in AH’s Envelope and ENV SWEEP something related to a swung matter-----boh?!
I should read Mutator’s specs…
But I strongly part with you on this
yes: Env Sweep = Env Depth
they are different machines obviously.
what’s more flexible on the mutator is:
that it’s really 2 mono filters with their own settings - and also you can let the 2 LFOs talk to each other.
Instant French Filter Sexyness.
Obviously there is a lot more to the AH that i don’t want to knock.
And if you look at it’s marketing the filter seemed to be only a side factor for Elektron.
(which i find sad, as Stereo Filters go a lot more expensive second hand than things that can distort)
Anyway - my main thing:
I can’t get it to sound as smooth on whole loops. If you can, please let’s exchange presets
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send loops 
and Mutronics example
IMHO:
Env Sweep = EnvDepth
Sens = “EnvGain”-ish (more like the Trig i would like to have in the AH. Because in the AH when adjusting the gain not much happens for a long time - and then it distorts a few ticks later. )
Again: I know the mutator was made with THIS in mind.
While it seems more a side option in the AH.
And I love the AH for a lot of other things also that the Mutator does not have…
Still: If you want to play around and find a option how you get it to feel smoother, obviously let me know please!
for the example:
https://www.elektronauts.com/uploads/default/original/3X/f/b/fbe88de0365834faa8f17ae1b21462b1202fb8c2.mp3
0:00-0:04: Mutator Filtered Loop, no ENV
0:04-0:08: Heat Filtered Loop, no ENV
0:08-0:24: Mutator not touching Freq or Res, ENV sweep down to -5, adjusting Sens, A+R
0:24-1:02: Heat FLW-Mode, not touching Freq, turing Filter ENV down to -90, adjusting Gain, A+R, Resonance
i looped the beginning of:
see above.
but any disco sample will do
EDIT: and i’m happy to then to have a “comparison go” in the mutator vst.
So…since I cannot export presets from AH I attach only an audio with four variations of that loop through AH (under my taste of course).
I feel the gap you hear between Mutator and AH about that "groovy swing"the Mutator has in its follower.
But, fwiw, I do not think this gap is that bad…I mean: AH spits so many incredible and even groovier variations because of its many controllable parameters.
I omitted other kind of variations I have stepped on while trying to modulate that disco loop. [there were indeed some incredible transient shaped stuff that were creating a kick from quite nothing!]
Anyway…
Here the flat loop:
And the Heat’ed ones:
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niiiice!
how did you do 0:10-0:15
everything else sounds quite like expected.
not bad obvsl, just different, like you say.
again i’m not really complaining, the AH is great. was just hoping i can stop dreaming of a real mutator.
because the filter of the plugin sounds like a 128kbps MP3
and € 2k for a 20+ year old one trick pony… :-p
cheers for your input.
btw: is there anything else you would like to hear from the mutator vst?
Here is my take on this disco loop …
My favorite part is around 1:05 (edit: I meant 1:15)
And the parameters used …
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Exactly!
I inadvertently cut the audio. So your favorite part is now 1:15 (and no longer at the end of the audio!!)
i couldn’t resist to give the Mutator VST a chance.
i have mapped it out on my Novation SL49 with automap.
- the first 5 minutes is only one channel in mono (to keep it fair on the AH).
- first with the filter quite open and the follower closing it
- then the filter closed and the follower closing it.
- after a while also a bit of LFO
- sometimes i added a kickdrum for reference and fun
then from 5:10 onwards it’s the full thing:
- left and right seperate controls for everything (btw: somehow the right envelope still is connected to the left)
- kick, hihat and snare (without any groove, just quickly added with ableton push)
2 Likes
sorry that we’ve landed a bit off-topic now…
i guess the point i want to make was:
the Heat has almost everything the mutator has (and much more).
Still the Mutator is soooo smooth - even as a plugin. there are hardy any non-sweet-spot settings.
if Elektron would tweak the possibilities of the AH a bit more i’m sure it could sound less harsh and could become a serious option for anybody who thinks about investing around 2000 eur into a Mutator, a Ebbe&Flut or such.
The filter itself sounds really good, i think it’s just the Follower that makes it so harsh.
#dreaming
it could even be with separate control for left and right where possible.
filter & follower could be realistic, just the LFO there is just one i guess
anyway:
am i alone in this bubble, or do you agree?
if yes: maybe we really make a separate topic to make it easier for others to join the discussion
(who are not too bothered about the TRIG knob and never would find their way here)
I’m all for additions or improvements to the AH, I have just got one again after selling my first one, the reason I sold it before was that I felt other gear that I own can do similar stuff, whilst that is still true what I did not account for was the convenience and tidy package that the AH offers, and to be perfectly truthful I don’t think I gave it enough of a chance before. Time will tell I guess.
I think the envelope and trig settings need to be set very carefully to get the best out of it for sure, I have not gone too deep with it just yet, but I spent an hour yesterday running a multi instrument loop through it and experimenting with all of the various settings, I think like the Sherman FB it is much easier to make the sound worse than it is to improve it, but there are plenty of nice things to be found also.
I’d like to see the EQ section have a bit more in the way of customisation, as well as the envelope/follower, I think that I want to try using a CV envelope from the A4 to see if that yields anything interesting, and it could also be fun to do some crush/fm stuff with pitched CVs too.
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