Best way to record analog rytm?

[xidnpnlss]

@""teomi""

@yesimsteve:

The Babyface’s XLR’s are balanced inputs that can be used a Mic or Line via the RME software. I realized it after looking at it again…

It’s a very basic Mic/Line design.
Every pro mixing desk has a switch on a channel strip that configures the balanced inputs to be either mic or line depending on what you hook into it.

If you set it to line, it bypasses the mic preamp.

With the babyface you set it in software.

If you want to hook up your AR to the babyface - do it via a TRS to XLR cable and use line level setting within the RME software.

Gain is for microphones. No need for the AR. The AR has plenty of gain when volume is at max - and by the way…the volume should be set to max when recording it to digital.

Hope this helps.
Eitan

I think that was to me, but, yeah…heaps of help.

I’ve already switched out the cables for balanced ones. A world of difference. No need for gain…and my mixes sound like garbage. WOOHOOO. Better late than never.

Thanks guys. Seriously.

[teomi]

I’m glad this was helpful to you @Xidnpnlss.

The next step is making your cables

Eitan

[stutech]

This thread has me scratching my head… If the signal sounds good coming in, just leave the input gain alone and boost volume later in the DAW? A simple linear gain operation in a DAW is much more “neutral” than most analog circuits.

Also, with 24bit recording, you will have a massive dynamic range, there’s absolutely no need to record hot. Have you checked which bits are used in a typical electronic music recording?

this “record as hot as possible” advice should be finally buried as it only applied during the 90s

As for using balanced vs unbalanced connections or using line level at unity vs. DI’ng and using a mic pre - there are theoretical “best practices” of course, but in the end what sounds good is good. Many people prefer using unbalanced outs with a Manley Massive passive for example, they somehow prefer the “technically inferior” sound. Also, some people like to use HP outs instead of balanced main outs because they sound different. So keep your mind open and experiment for best results… When in doubt, level-matched A/B testing of signalpaths will reveal all.

[cedmondson]

@""teomi""

Sorry guys there’s a bit of confusing advice here…

The Analog Rytm outputs LINE level signals.
This is not the same as INSTRUMENT level and certainly not the same as MICROPHONE level!

To record the Rytm you need a balanced Line level cable.
If your audio interface has Line inputs via 1/4’’ connectors then you need a Balanced 1/4’’ cable (balanced means that the 1/4’’ cable is a TRS or “Stereo”).

If your interface has an XLR Line input then you need to have an XLR on one end… it’s still just a balanced cable.

INSTRUMENT output level is considerably lower than line level. Instrument level is what comes out of electric guitars, basses etc.
The Rytm doesn’t output instrument level. Instrument level also differ in Impedance from Line level, therefore, connecting the Rytm to an “Instrument” input is not a good choice.

There’s really no reason to use a preamp here unless you want to add (even more) coloration to the sound.

If you want to use a preamp in your chain, you have to realize that a preamp’s input handles MICROPHONE levels.
In order to use it properly with a LINE level device like the RYTM, you need to first attenuate the output to mic level.

This is what DI boxes do.

What you do then is connect the Rytm to a DI (1/4’’ - XLR) and then connect the output of the DI to your preamp. then you can raise the gain on your preamp to get a proper recording level.

Now to answer your original question
The best way to record requires a good interface with good AD converters. It also requires good cables. Cables make a difference!

I only use StarQuad cables (4 conductor cable). The two main companies that manufacture 4 conductor cables are either Mogami or Canare. Both are considered the industry standard for high-end cable.

They are more expensive than your regular store bought cable, but if you learn to solder it’s cheaper than the cheapest store bought cable…

If you hear a difference between the headphone out and the soundcard out, there are several factors to consider:

[ul]
[li]Too long of a signal path[/li]
[li]Mediocre cables[/li]
[li]Sample rate/Bit depth of the recorded signal?[/li]
[li]Mediocre sound card…[/li]
[/ul]

Hope this helps.
Eitan

Eitan, with the Canare Star Quad cable is it a narrower gauge than standard 1/4" cables? I have heard they are and require something to beef them up at the connector for relief.

[teomi]

Canare makes various gauges for their cable.
If you get this for permanent installs (patch bays…)

http://www.canare.com/ProductItemDisplay.aspx?productItemID=54

And this for gear hookup:

http://www.canare.com/ProductItemDisplay.aspx?productItemID=53

you should be fine. It’s standard gauge so every connector should work just fine.

Eitan

[cedmondson]

Eitan,

I have bunch of old Canare cables. They are over 20 years old now. I bought them when I was living in Japan and they are still as good as new. Very high quality product. Unfortunately at the time I didn’t realize that they were unbalanced! So I have a huge box of great guitar cables:-)

Out of curiosity, I did an experiment and plugged in a balanced cable in one of the stereo outputs of the AK and one of the unbalanced Canare cables into the other and there was absolutely no difference in either volume level or audio quality so my interface (UA Apollo) must be compensating for the unbalanced signal or something.

In any case, I still need a bunch of cables to wire up a patch bay and to make some additional connections. Definitely makes financial sense to solder up my own and I have had very good experience with the brand. Thanks for the recommendations.

[teomi]

If you have a quality cable (like Canare) and the cable run is short there shouldn’t be much different in quality and level between Bal/Unbal especially if the gear you are connecting is pro level - which is in your case.

When you are talking 20 feet and longer and when you are talking about Microphone levels. Then is when the cables make a LOT of difference.

Also when wiring up a patchbay I will ALWAYS use StarQuad (4 conductor) cables. There are just too many things that can go wrong if you don’t because there are so many cables in close proximity including power lines…

[HOOOPS]

Dear Kotare,

That sounds very interesting.

At the moment I route the kick individually to one track in Ableton and the rest as “Drumbus” together including effects and compression from AR. So I can edit the kick individually with an EQ and the rest gets a glue effect.

How do you route the drums and which groups do you form that would be of great interest to me. thank you for your time.

i am thinking about to get Warm Audio Bus Comp to glue the beat in a smart way together.

Warm Audio Bus-Comp