Advice on Mac/PC

The Lounge General Discussion
#21

a second hand mac would be my suggestion … I have the 2012 mac mini and I am underwhelmed by the whole experience … the idea of having a little headless machine was attractive but it is substantially slower as an overall experience than I had on a 10yr old now dead iMac albeit that wasn’t running Mavericks … IMHO Apple will cripple everything you buy if you let them, so getting a combo of hardware and OS in a sweet spot with hopes of support on audio soft side would be the thing to aim for - I also needed support for FireWire without being robbed on the dongles roundabout game they play

a mobile device without an easily serviceable battery becomes a consumable so I wouldn’t go for a MBP if I even had the money - I always found the iMac to be the best overall package, best value, good performance, good screen, just a good package … a recent second hand one would be on my radar if I was in the market

all my recent apple devices are surprisingly useless, yet the older ones still sing along, though frozen in time somewhat … go figure ! I can scarcely hide my contempt for their approach to hardware, software, music and standards so don’t take my opinions too seriously … i’d consider a windows machine in the future too, apple stuff is just too pricey for the longevity these days not to mention the constant OS merrygoround … was a fan, not a fan, may have been more of a fan if I could have got an iMac when I had another machine failure :nej:

#22

I have a custom built i5, 10gb RAM, W10 that’s over 7 years old. It still works great for me. In Reaper it might start chugging along at 60+ tracks and god knows how many VSTs. But nothing terrible and almost never crashes (and thats when it’s working very hard.)

I don’t use OB VST so can’t comment there.

Thinking of upgrading myself and haven’t even considered a Mac. Far too expensive for such inane limitations IMO (Dongles. Dongles everywhere.).

I think the Surface wave is very interesting (have you seen that PC? That’s something…) but still in the fledgling stages. By the time I need a new one after this next one I’m sure the dust will have settled.

#23

studio usage

ok working on a battery and travelling is not an issue

i want to go in via overbridge for the AK and AR to take advantage of the seperate outs

Ok so on MacOS you will have problem each time an OS is released and on Mac it’s every year. W10 is blocked now to this version only few enhancement options and bug, security fix will coming so if it’s working on W10 it will ever worked for years to come that’s something to bear in mind i guess

I also use a variety of VST’s and such for the digital side of things.

Do you see if you’re VST are PC/MAC available because it’s not the case everytime

So i was looking for something powerful but with a smaller footprint.

I think Surface Pro, Surface Book (if budget), ASUS Laptop are possible great choice (small budget). Mac mini on SSD with 8go RAM at least better on i7 quad for sure (small budget), Macbook Pro 13 SSD i7 8go RAM (SSD256 is the perfect choice ever) (if budget)

Don’t forget a cooler solution for LapTop, never use it on your knees in the BED Laptop is overwhelm a lot and need to be consider in this way to keep it long time otherwise 2-3 years and they coming to drop progressively

#24

Does the Surface Pro support multitouch with your DAW? One thing I like about DAWs on iPad vs. desktop computer is being able to go direct to tracks and other stuff with my fingers, instead of having to reach for a mouse.

#25

Another vote for used 2012 Mac Pros and MBPs. I’ve got a 2012 MBP that’s still trucking along, and just learned that it can actually be upgraded from 8 GB to 16 GB RAM, so I’ll be looking to do that in the near future to extend its life instead of buying a new MBP. And I got a 2012 6 core Mac Pro earlier this year with 32 GB RAM and a bunch of upgrades for relatively cheap as my main studio computer which I will just continue to upgrade as necessary, so I’m good for a minute. Unfortunately, with the way Apple are doing things it looks like I may end up returning back to Windows and PCs whenever it’s time to get a new machine, because the direction they’ve taken since Tim Cook took over seems antithetical to my needs.

#26

AGREE 200% me Too return back to PC firstly with a Laptop for Nomad Music then for the Studio…

#27

Bitwig supports multi-touch (which is what I use); they have for quite a while now: Microsoft had a Bitwig presentation during the Surface Pro 4/Surface Book launch. I think a couple of other DAWs do as well, but even those that don’t I assume are working on implementing it. (The Surface Studio, the new mega desktop in the line, basically says: use touch already.)

#28

I have a mid range Surface Pro 4 i5 128gb which i use for my work. I’ve done some tracks on it mainly using Ableton and Audacity.

Works really well for audio but only has one USB3 port so you need to get a hub of sorts if you’re going to use a wired mouse, audio interface and plug in other goodies.

Fantastic portability and you don’t look ridiculous using it on the train … small and light enough to have in my bag daily.

The Pro 4 screen is only 12" with a very high resolution (2736 x 1834px) so you either need great eyesight, drop the resolution down or increase scaling in the settings of the windows interface.

Some apps like Photoshop CS6 don’t scale so the icons and toolbars can be miniscule! Fortunately Ableton scales fine and there’s a lot of real estate for channels and tracks.

I think the Surface Book has a larger screen and even the base model is much more powerful so you should be all good.

I haven’t used my surface pro 4 for audio since I got the dark trinity electron gear and only just installed overbridge last week on my main desktop PC - which is an Intel i7 4ghz monster with 32gb ram and 512gb raid SSD drives!

I love this Surface Pro and use it 90% of the time for my work … they monitor your pc useage at the office and I can get around this by tethering to my phone and watching gear porn and chatting in forums :stuck_out_tongue:

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#29

if it is for studio a custom PC desktop build is the best way to go, more power, better components, better price. I run my AK through OB without problems in my custom PC.

In windows laptops drivers for trackpads, keyboards, wireles cards, etc can be quite disrupting if they are bad, introducing latency or messing with overall performance. In that regard MBP have an advantage, but maybe Microsoft products are perfect on this regard, or getting better, .

But MBp are getting so expensive and I don’t feel the specifications are so good for the price, it is way too low value for the money.

#30

Thanks for the info. Besides my iPad, the other Apple product I rely on is my iMac, but aside from occasional Ableton Live use, the iMac mostly serves as a file manager for my OP-1 and Octatrack. :wink:

I’ve had 3 Apple laptops plus 2 provided by the workplace. They have outlasted the Dell laptops that I’ve had (all work-provided). But I find I prefer the iPad for travel and mobile music-making over a full laptop - well, unless I decided to bring my OP-1 or one of the Volcas with me to play with on the train. I have no interest in the latest line of Macbooks.

The iPad though is now too old to run Korg Odyssei, and I’m sure it won’t be long before more and more apps get updated to run only on 64-bit IOS devices. It doesn’t hurt to explore options for the future. :slight_smile:

#31

It’s better resolution than my iPad 4th gen, which has 2048 x 1536 resolution. My eyesight isn’t great, but I can deal with my iPad just fine. :sunglasses:

#32

So many options on this…!!! My head swims.
Ive been put off the Apple route a tad, the IMac maybe being a possible contender still. Ive been considering an alienware perhaps or another gaming laptop… they seem to have good system specs although the aesthetics can be an aquired taste. Has anyone any experience of these or similar? And also the surface book/studio is an interesting avenue. In truth theyre all capable machines, i just need to think about upgrade paths/longevity which it seems is where the Apples fall down compared.
Research research research… more research and then a decision!!

#33

Old MBP Late 2010 here - no issues with OB at all running El Capitan. But im only using it for recording i must admit - since i try to work without the Computer as often as possible. PC with Win7 had loads of issues with OB on my side. Will NEVER use this anymore!

#34

Apple is dumping the creative market and making strong moves towards the lowest common denominator public market with each new hardware cycle - in fact the latest MBPs have ZERO!!! I/O other than USB-C… not sure about you but thats 100% dealbreaker in my book… and also a bad idea in general IMO… Im with whoever else said it, and I myself said it the day Jobs died… Apple will be following him soon. Yeh it usually takes a corp a decade or two to fully “die” in terms of their past form (i.e. Dell, IBM, etc.) but its inevitable at this point. I doubt the corp will go away but its going to be another Dell quite soon. McComputers for the “stylish” yuppie crowd.

Im an Apple certified technician, Ive even worked directly for Apple Inc in the past (as tech support), and I have never really liked their products that much, even back in the day when they were almost designed specifically for creatives exclusively… there is just far too much propietary bullshit and lack of flexibility - on the flipside, you get more stability and sometimes better performance… but ultimately its nothing you cant get on a well-specced well maintained PC - and in fact if you know what you are doing a well customized (and therefore specialized) PC will completely destroy a Mac in any and all endeavors, for a much cheaper price…

Hell even Unix coders are starting to jump ship at this point…

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#35

If you’re looking primarily for studio use, I’d steer away from laptops. The batteries in laptops may be rechargeable, but they don’t last forever. I believe 2 years is the typical lifespan for a Macbook battery. I haven’t had a Dell for a while, but I don’t think the Windows laptop batteries last much longer. My point is that when the battery in your laptop starts to die, it creates various problems - from having to reboot the laptop twice or more, to other stuff that will drive you nuts.

I lost my last personally owned Macbook when the fan stopped working. No working fan dramatically shortened the life of the motherboard. I also learned the hard way that the headphone out is part of the motherboard. When that stops working, it is a sign the days are numbered for your laptop. Motherboard replacement is so expensive you might as well get another computer.

The Surface is kind of a special case. I’m going to keep tabs on how that platform continues to develop and progress, just in case Apple does something catastrophic to the iPad line.

#36

Though I don’t use it for music, the battery in my Dell laptop has lasted 10 years so far.

#37

I’ve been thinking of an upgrade to my laptop for a while now too, was going to jump on the new macbook but we know how that turned out :confused:

Think I’ll go for the Dell XPS 15 now its pretty slick and portable, has HD, ram and battery that can be user replaced.

#38

Not just a Mac problem, it’s been seen on lots of USB 3 devices on other platforms, windows, Linux, it’s the USB 3

#39

My MacBook Pro is almost four years old, battery still lasts up to 10 hours or so. Running Mavericks, never have had a crash(knock on cpu), and OB has never stuttered.

#40

I forgot to add the usual “YMMV” disclaimer.

My last Macbook Pro was a 2007 model, purchased as a refurb in 2008. It lived until 2014. So I guess the lifespan was 6 years - not a bad run for a laptop. Replaced battery twice.

Headphone output went bad around 2013. Fan stopped working 2014. Motherboard was hosed soon after.

I stand by my main point though - the OP wants a studio computer, and I advise him to reconsider his idea of getting a laptop. For making music and recording, I think you should only get a laptop if you are absolutely sure you’re going to playing shows with one. A desktop might not be as sexy-looking to him, but would probably be more reliable. JMO, of course.

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