Ableton to OT. Your method for converting for live performance

nedavine · 2013-07-16T05:37:42.000Z

So I am trying to export tracks from my album so that I can perform them live on the OT but its such a mind bender. I want to tweak and play around live but keep the overall structure of the ing, introduce transitions just for live performance. How do you go about wrapping your head around?

At the moment I am grappling with this relatively small project but still struggling.

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Audiolog · 2013-07-16T08:57:41.000Z

One way is to use a long ( or multiply) wavefile(s) and slice it with static machines, and then lock each of the slices to a patterns … with this method you can keep it pretty much as it sounds in ableton and keep room for improvisation with neighbor machines… this method has its setbacks tho, but is really nice if you need a flexible backtrack.

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the_dreammer · 2013-07-16T13:56:42.000Z

Audiolog is correct,

slicing is the way… that and just a small difrent aproach in things…
I got “your problem” but coming from a renoise enviroment.

I do have some thoughts on the problem, and i think i am cracking the code in a way that works for me personally… its not completely crystalized so bare with me…
its just a dump of my work-sheet… Its for a set i want to do in the nextdoor pub
and i might go with just 16 songs instead of 64… this because i dont want to puzzle with renoise to long…

basicly as soon as i find out how i slice it and how i globally want to build a pattern… (all patterns will be exactly the same in tracks, not in fx and scenes through use of parts)
I might just go with part1=buildup part2=mainsong part3=climax part4=transitioningprep

I make a project in renoise, that will give me the propper export as in correct length samples and loops and blabla all sliceable by the same parameters as the others of that type in that project.

anyways… the dump… i hope it helps :

128 Static sampleslots Globally
16banks
4 parts Per bank
16 patterns which be attached to any of the 4 parts in that bank

So 1 bank. 4 patterns. 4 part
You could argue that you do
1 song per part.
that means 4 songs per bank
that means 4 patterns per song
That means we can calculate the full amount of songs.
we got 16 banks… and 4 songs per bank.
so we got 16 * 4 songs…
64 songs…
If i devide the amount of available sample-slots by the number of songs (64)
i get 2 sample-slots per song.
So if we can populate 4 patterns and put 2 samples across it.
we get the need for slices. else we will not have enough audio to
be spread across the 8 available tracks.
The question becomes what are we going to do with the 8 tracks.
Track 1 : BassLines
Track 2 : Drums
Track 3 : Synths
Track 4 : Vocals
Track 5 : Unused
Track 6 : unused
track 7 : Transitioning and sliceMyBeat action
track 8 : Mastertrack
So in the trackcount. tracks 7 and 8 are not reading from the static sample pool.
track 5 and 6 can either hold other machines via thru-machine and be used at later stage
or for some extra realtime sampling tricks
So basicly we got 4 tracks per song. 2 samples per song and we got 4 patterns per song.
so 4 times 4 = 16 Songparts … you could do that in 1 sample and slice it 16 times, but
no variations…
each sample can contain 64 slices… and we found out we need atleast 16 of them
64 / 16 = 4… for each slice you can have 4 variations. or 4 “in between slices”
lets take a bar for example
1 bar has 4 beats.
so i could slice per beat
2 bars have 8 beats
so i could slice per 2 beats
4 bars have 16 beats
so you slice per bar.
So it might be a good idea to have 2 samples… 1 with short slices as in 1 per beat
the other with 2 beats per slice… this give much room to create variations needed
that means 2 samples per part… but i need 4 tracks…
So if i devide 1 sample over 64 slices… each part gets 16 slices…
thats 4 slices per pattern. or 16 slices per song…

Tarekith · 2013-07-16T14:08:10.000Z

Here’s how I went from Live to the OT:

http://tarekith.com/elektron-live-pa-rundown/

natrixgli · 2013-07-16T14:21:46.000Z

""Tarekith"":

Here’s how I went from Live to the OT:

http://tarekith.com/elektron-live-pa-rundown/

Ooh, thanks a lot for taking the time to do that writeup. I will have to bookmark it for later reading since I’m at work right now. But cheers, looking forward to it.

I am doing a similar thing, but working from a more rock-ish song structure and I’ve never performed this stuff before, even with Live. (well except maybe a few times for my cat, but he wasn’t impressed!) I have only played keyboard and drums in rock bands so this is a bit new for me. But I’m pretty psyched about learning, after all that’s part of the fun.

jonah · 2013-07-17T20:03:08.000Z

Computer as sound module, exploit MIDI control and your 4 audio inputs.

Drum racks! Or whatever other cool features your program of choice has.

As I play around I resample and save transitions that work. That way I can play around, but still have an overall flow and direction.

Not gonna lie though, I’ve always made music like this and never got on with the idea of using a linear arranger to finish a song, only as a place to get started.

nedavine · 2013-07-18T00:42:17.000Z

""the_dreammer"":

Audiolog is correct,

slicing is the way… that and just a small difrent aproach in things…
I got “your problem” but coming from a renoise enviroment.

I do have some thoughts on the problem, and i think i am cracking the code in a way that works for me personally… its not completely crystalized so bare with me…
its just a dump of my work-sheet… Its for a set i want to do in the nextdoor pub
and i might go with just 16 songs instead of 64… this because i dont want to puzzle with renoise to long…

basicly as soon as i find out how i slice it and how i globally want to build a pattern… (all patterns will be exactly the same in tracks, not in fx and scenes through use of parts)
I might just go with part1=buildup part2=mainsong part3=climax part4=transitioningprep

I make a project in renoise, that will give me the propper export as in correct length samples and loops and blabla all sliceable by the same parameters as the others of that type in that project.

anyways… the dump… i hope it helps :

128 Static sampleslots Globally
16banks
4 parts Per bank
16 patterns which be attached to any of the 4 parts in that bank

So 1 bank. 4 patterns. 4 part
You could argue that you do
1 song per part.
that means 4 songs per bank
that means 4 patterns per song
That means we can calculate the full amount of songs.
we got 16 banks… and 4 songs per bank.
so we got 16 * 4 songs…
64 songs…
If i devide the amount of available sample-slots by the number of songs (64)
i get 2 sample-slots per song.
So if we can populate 4 patterns and put 2 samples across it.
we get the need for slices. else we will not have enough audio to
be spread across the 8 available tracks.
The question becomes what are we going to do with the 8 tracks.
Track 1 : BassLines
Track 2 : Drums
Track 3 : Synths
Track 4 : Vocals
Track 5 : Unused
Track 6 : unused
track 7 : Transitioning and sliceMyBeat action
track 8 : Mastertrack
So in the trackcount. tracks 7 and 8 are not reading from the static sample pool.
track 5 and 6 can either hold other machines via thru-machine and be used at later stage
or for some extra realtime sampling tricks
So basicly we got 4 tracks per song. 2 samples per song and we got 4 patterns per song.
so 4 times 4 = 16 Songparts … you could do that in 1 sample and slice it 16 times, but
no variations…
each sample can contain 64 slices… and we found out we need atleast 16 of them
64 / 16 = 4… for each slice you can have 4 variations. or 4 “in between slices”
lets take a bar for example
1 bar has 4 beats.
so i could slice per beat
2 bars have 8 beats
so i could slice per 2 beats
4 bars have 16 beats
so you slice per bar.
So it might be a good idea to have 2 samples… 1 with short slices as in 1 per beat
the other with 2 beats per slice… this give much room to create variations needed
that means 2 samples per part… but i need 4 tracks…
So if i devide 1 sample over 64 slices… each part gets 16 slices…
thats 4 slices per pattern. or 16 slices per song…

Thanks for the reply. I wont lie, this is very much over my head right now though. Too much maths involved. Are you simply saying you can have a total of four songs per bank because of the parts limitation?

I do appreciate the detailed response im just a bit of a newb.

Tarekith

Thanks for the write up. I will read that in a moment (busy work day).

nedavine · 2013-07-18T00:43:08.000Z

""jonah"":

Computer as sound module, exploit MIDI control and your 4 audio inputs.

Drum racks! Or whatever other cool features your program of choice has.

As I play around I resample and save transitions that work. That way I can play around, but still have an overall flow and direction.

Not gonna lie though, I’ve always made music like this and never got on with the idea of using a linear arranger to finish a song, only as a place to get started.

Great idea

the_dreammer · 2013-07-18T01:11:00.000Z

Thats ok, I got my OT for a while now, and i am still fiddling with the maths.
thats why i shared my braindump… anyways to come back to your question.

Simply put: in 1 part its easy to setup a new song. as in samples for your tracks to play.
and yes, there are 4 parts per bank.
and 16 banks. So 64 songs max accessible with this “format”

the problem i have (thats why the math)
I got 128 static sample slots (and 128 flex, but that doesnt have unlimited memory like the static slots)

so if i divide 128 static sampleslots, by 64 songs… i end up having 2 sampleslots per song… thats not really enough

so if you go for 32 songs (2 parts per song) you will have 4 samples per song
if you go for 16 songs (4 parts per song) you will have 8 samples per song

I hope this is clear…

the rest of the calculations is me trying to figure out how to get 1 song in 1 sample … u can do that by making complicated “sample-chains”
(something they describe here http://www.elektron-users.com/index.php?option=com_fireboard&Itemid=28&func=view&id=155708&catid=9 on the old forum…)

that way i got 64 sample-slots left for “other fun” so i get more fun out of my machine …

So I hope that cleared up some of the “weird unknown + long math attached” post…

Enjoy your machine… its great fun… even if you do things without math and complication

nedavine · 2013-07-18T15:28:49.000Z

Thanks for clarifying. I getchya now.

I just recorded my first proper go on the OT. Only had it a few days so its nothing special… way too much of the glitchy beat stuff. But it was fun. Just mopho sequenced by OT.

the_dreammer · 2013-07-18T17:09:19.000Z

""nedavine"":

Thanks for clarifying. I getchya now.

I just recorded my first proper go on the OT. Only had it a few days so its nothing special… way too much of the glitchy beat stuff. But it was fun. Just mopho sequenced by OT.

No problem mate, thats why we on forum… to discuss and learn
the better i know how to explain what i mean, the better i know my machine…

had a listen to your song… i like it… nice and simple… my wife liked it.
Did you film it with an 3d camera thing?? something like a minoru?
or is it just an anaglyphic filter?

nedavine · 2013-07-18T23:53:12.000Z

Just a filter. Figured as is was a little boring.

Thanks for listening its a little repetitive but it was all done on the OT so I don’t expect miracles right off the bat.

the_dreammer · 2013-07-19T01:05:54.000Z

""nedavine"":

Just a filter. Figured as is was a little boring.

Thanks for listening its a little repetitive but it was all done on the OT so I don’t expect miracles right off the bat.

Ah, just the filter… fair enough… funny enough…
i am not sure if people mind if you just show “a boring movie of your fingers moving the buttons” … I put allot of effort in my clippies, but it doesnt exactly get me more viewers… a pat on the shoulder by some cause they enjoy the extra effort… yes… more viewers… no

and as far as the music goes… your right… machine will grow on you… get more out of it… but for a first attempt thing… i like it… the misses liked it… so nothign wrong there… who cares its a bit simplistic. if its nice its nice

nedavine · 2013-07-19T02:00:42.000Z

""the_dreammer"":

[quote=“nedavine”]Just a filter. Figured as is was a little boring.

Thanks for listening its a little repetitive but it was all done on the OT so I don’t expect miracles right off the bat.

Ah, just the filter… fair enough… funny enough…
i am not sure if people mind if you just show “a boring movie of your fingers moving the buttons” … I put allot of effort in my clippies, but it doesnt exactly get me more viewers… a pat on the shoulder by some cause they enjoy the extra effort… yes… more viewers… no

and as far as the music goes… your right… machine will grow on you… get more out of it… but for a first attempt thing… i like it… the misses liked it… so nothign wrong there… who cares its a bit simplistic. if its nice its nice[/quote]

You got a link?

the_dreammer · 2013-07-19T12:11:03.000Z

a link : http://www.youtube.com/dedreammer <- there ya go

nedavine · 2013-07-20T14:57:02.000Z

""the_dreammer"":

a link : http://www.youtube.com/dedreammer ← there ya go

Nice videos man. Thanks for sharing. Did you do the stop animation for the fidget?

I’ve been having a whale of a time with the OT over the weekend. Got two new videos. This thing is a riot.

the_dreammer · 2013-07-20T15:51:13.000Z

""nedavine"":

[quote=“the_dreammer”]a link : http://www.youtube.com/dedreammer ← there ya go

Nice videos man. Thanks for sharing. Did you do the stop animation for the fidget?

I’ve been having a whale of a time with the OT over the weekend. Got two new videos. This thing is a riot.[/quote]

Yes, i did the stopmotion for do the fidget… its actually worse… I did all of them myself … its something i do to keep the creative juices flowing when i dont feel musical…

I am glad you like your octatrack… and i agree. its lots of fun.
its a nice thing… ease of a computer… playabillity of a groovebox