I’m learning about filters in preparation for a MSW Xena/Ambika purchase (thread). I can choose from -24db and -12db filter options.
After listening to many examples. I’m getting the impression that:
-24db (4-pole) LP sweep is more noticeable, superior for a “cool” meant-to-be-heard effect
-12db (2-pole) LP sweep is less noticeable, superior for subtle sound design / ambient shifts
Does this match with your use and experience? I’m curious if anyone here is particular enough to select one filter or the other when recording a part. My Deluge has options for both -12db and -24db filters, so I can test-run any listening assignments you might have.
I ripped off the graphic from reddit, but the 24db will always be more prominent due to the rapid slope you see on the graph here, it basically indicates the degree of roll off as it occurs progressively as it reaches 80hz and beyond.
12db is not always subtle though, it’s just not as fast acting, like a polivox filter at 12db is still pretty zippy.
I know you can buy extra voice cards, but that’s a pretty hifi sounding synth and unless you’re doing a lot of leads, I might go with the 12db. I’ll have to listen to the sound demos though.
I think that the filter type is an important attribute in addition to the number of poles.
Generally I prefer a 24db though, a classic Moog ladder cannot be beaten - but your example of the SMR4 is another amazing one - there is a richness to them - a butteriness, thickness that exemplifies what a synth filter is all about.
12db filters can work better for pad sounds or, as you say, where more subtle filter EG’s are wanted - but they can sometimes sound a bit anaemic - more like an EQ.
Thank you. Yeah I guess the speed of the sweep is a key factor in how noticeable it would be. Ironically I was planning to get an Acidbox to put on the Xena’s effects chain, I assumed it was -24db based on how it sounds in demos.
Trust your ears, every time I try to convince myself my ears are the problem I always end up disappointed that I doubted what I was hearing. If you’re going to pick one off instinct and back it up with research and you can’t decide based on facts, go with what initially grabbed you.
Like if it was a youtube video, find out which voice card was being used. Reach out to the content creator if necessary. It won’t change the synth, but it might change your experience with it.
The Acidbox has a Polivox filter, which as @shigginpit rightly points out is a gnarly 12db - this is kind of my point with regard to the type of filter being just as important. You also get 24db filters that don’t have the richness of an SMR4 or Ladder, and can just kind of ‘cut’ the sound. Resonance is a complex beast.
Ah, yes totally agree. When my naive ears were first listening to -12db I was thinking it sounded like 50/50 split between volume reduction and a filter. The SMR4 LP has a very musical smoothness to it. I’m thinking that filter would give the Xena the best resale value if I did not click with it. But on the other hand, their -12db SVF filter is the only option that offers BP and HP, which I want. Tough choice, both seem to have their merits
4-pole normally because I like the how quickly and deeply it can dampen a sound, and sounds pretty and more intimate, a few qualities I pursue. Also I have a fear of drowning and somehow I seek sounds that remind me of being underwater. I think I like to manifest my unsubscription with sound. Fun.
I’ll switch to 2-pole if I want less dampening and more “buzz”.
2 pole only really cuts it for polys imo, theres not many mono synths that only have a 2 pole lpf, the korg ms-20 is one, their had a 12db lpf in their poly as well.
its more common a state variable filter like morphable between low pass -> band pass -> high pass
I have the doepfer wasp filter which is variable, the oberheim SEM was a 12db state variable as well. I have make noise lxd which has a 12db and 6db filter.
The wasp and sem are iconic, same with the ms-20 really, for mono sounds at least. The 12db lxd is good for plucky/percussive sounds and the 6db is good just for toning things down a bit.
now that i think about it 12dbs are good for gentler lead sounds as well, think like softer synth pop vs agressive techno/club music. You can do both with either, more of a vibe i guess.
Sometimes 24db can be too steep, like I cant find the right balance between filtered and open. Usually fixable with filter envelope, but sometimes simpler monos dont have a dedicated filter envelope, only 1 envelope shared with the vca. I’d take a 24db any day though.
